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Review: NCISLA “A Tale of Two Igors” (S12E18)

With “A Tale of Two Igors,” NCIS: Los Angeles closed the books on Season 12. How time flies! The season finale script, written by Kyle Harimoto and showrunner R. Scott Gemmill, was likely completed before the show received its renewal notice, and its air of possible finality provided a bittersweet quality even as the laugh out loud jokes flew fast and furiously.

The Funny

One of the episode’s strengths was its light tone, chosen by the showrunners to “do a fun, feel-good episode that leaves everyone happy and hopeful for what is coming down the line.” A major character was kidnapped, yet we never feared that he or anyone else was truly in danger. This carefree approach was very much in keeping with R. Scott Gemmill’s work, particularly over the last few seasons, as he embraced a wackier version of Beale and wrote (or co-wrote) a number of episodes that more closely resembled a single-camera comedy than they did a weekly procedural. For examples, see “Kill Beale Vol. 1,” “Till Death Do Us Part,” “Hail Mary,” “Love Kills,” and “Russia, Russia, Russia.”

The bulk of the humor was driven by Admiral Kilbride’s curmudgeonliness (nope I don’t think that’s a word either) and by Deeks’ newly inherited Russian crime syndicate. Kilbride had my second favorite line of the night in that hilarious scene where Nell got caught shaving off Beale’s stache: “Please don’t. You’ll only make it more disturbing.”

While I’d pay money for an angsty Deeks kidnapping storyline, it was hard to argue with the hilarity that ensued when Kirkin’s former staff nabbed him in search of a new trustworthy leader. Before the credits had even rolled, the jaunty background music told us that we shouldn’t worry about his fate, and the tone let us know that Gemmill had contributed to the writing.

Kirkin’s gang would have made him proud, taking care of Deeks’ nutritional needs and succeeding (mostly anyway) in freeing the Russian military dolphins. What a ridiculous storyline that I fully embraced right down to the final shot of the dolphins enjoying their newfound freedom. It served as a wonderful final(?) tribute to a beloved character. (It would be great to see more Kirkin-generated “gifts” in future episodes- the possibilities are endless.)

The bad guys were also quite amusing. I’d like to think that Igor 1 got his job because of his blond locks (or else it was a job requirement for him to dye his hair). The way all the guest actors, but particularly Igor 1’s Sandi Todorovic, delivered their lines with total seriousness and sincerity made them all the funnier. Henry crying over the dolphins, and then admitting to accidently shooting one, was a great touch too.

Eric Christian Olsen held up his end of this fun storyline. He perfectly delivered Deeks’ exasperation with being kidnapped. We didn’t even need to see his face under that hood to know his exact expression when he uttered a frustrated “Kirkin!” at the drive through. Deeks’ ability to do his job while embracing the craziness (telling a caller “Dasvidaniya”, for example) added to the fun. My favorite exchange of the entire episode was his quick delivery of “No one is over this Russian thing more than I am, no offense to you Grisha,” followed by Callen’s immediate “No offense Martin.” I hope that put a smile on every viewer’s face like it did on mine.

The Sweet

While I’m not sure if it was really him surfing (why can’t we get a clear shot of ECO in action on the waves?), Surfer Deeks will always be my favorite Deeks. This storyline also gave us a few seconds of Worried Kensi; seeing her protectiveness towards her husband is always welcome. We also got a relaxed and happy Densi at the end. Hearing Kensi joke and laugh out loud lets us go off to hiatus knowing they’re in as good a place as they can be. Plus, how adorable is it that she thinks of Deeks as her “little mermaid”? (I believe the term is merman, Kensi.)

The Grumpy (and Gruff and Crusty)

The episode was filled with grumpy characters. Ironically all the “crustiness” contributed to some of the funny one-liners, most courtesy of Kilbride as usual. Still, it was a lot of grumpiness to deal with. Kilbride’s gruffness had a harder edge than usual, with his ultimatum to Nell and his attitude toward Callen adding a nastier than usual tone to their conversations.

Kilbride’s telling Callen that Hetty “created” him brought up echoes from “Mother,” with its story of Hetty’s attempts to “help” orphans by molding them into agents and spies. Was this a clue that Kilbride knows something about Callen’s history with Hetty? Is that what Callen was searching for amidst the paper files? The whole conversation came out of the blue but might lead to some interesting places next season (spoiler alert: perhaps it will lead to learning more about Callen’s childhood, as Gemmill mentioned in a TVLine article).

Also in the Mr. Grumpypants category was Sam, who barely listened to anything Rountree had to offer on the case because of his preoccupation with Aiden’s flight test. At least Callen was able to pry his worries out of him and then offer appropriate support.

And then there was Fatima. Lashing out at others because you’re upset is not an attractive quality (see Kensi and Sam at various times, including the previous paragraph). Here, Fatima was giving off more attitude than a teenager. Kensi had the perfect reaction, a combination of hurt and anger, when she tried to get Fatima to open up and Fatima attacked her. I hope she can develop more maturity over time to enable her to handle her feelings better.

The Bittersweet

When Fatima did finally share the reason behind her poor attitude, it at least gave us an understanding of why she’d been so unpleasant all day. More important, it provided us with a key element of her backstory, the reason she changed from acting to fighting for the good guys. I can admire her for that change, although it doesn’t yet make me want to spend more time with her. (And no, I’m not bitter that we now know why a first-year team member made a career change when we still don’t know why Deeks shifted from attorney to cop. It’s all good.)

The lead duo of Callen and Sam got some nice scenes together, with Callen getting his partner to open up about his worries, with them reminiscing over the last trying year, and finally with Sam letting Callen know that he’d be a great dad. Chris O’Donnell beautifully played out the subtle emotions Callen experienced on hearing that compliment. And is that another breadcrumb about possible directions for this character to take next season? I can only hope that Densi has a child first to spare them the additional angst of watching their friends become parents before they do.

The episode’s big news, and the source of much of its emotion, was the apparently official departure of both Renée Felice Smith and Barrett Foa. Having Beale return provided a lovely way to usher Nell away, with a promise of new challenges and perhaps a rekindling of their romantic relationship. Their scenes here provided a reminder of how well they worked together, and how integral they’ve been to the cast. The two got a literal happy ending, riding off into the sunset, singing along to the music as they sped up the coast in a crazy expensive Lamborghini.

Yet even though we know Nell was never happy with her new job as Acting Operations Manager, her decision to depart NCIS and her subsequent good-bye scenes held multiple layers because we knew they were also our good-byes to the actress, and by extension, to Barrett. Seeing Kensi say farewell to the one person besides Deeks that she’s been able to open up to was a definite bittersweet scene, and knowing how emotional it must have been for Daniela Ruah and Renée made it doubly so. I only wished we’d have had time to let Nell and Deeks have a similar moment, but instead we got to enjoy a couple final doses of Beale-Deeks silliness. In lieu of a Shaggy-Velma scene, be sure to check out ECO’s description posted on twitter of working with her on that amazing scene from “Raising the Dead” where Deeks is fired.

The big reveal of the night, at least to viewers who hadn’t seen any spoilers, was Linda Hunt’s return. Just like with the fictional Densi wedding, I’d have to assume that Linda was determined to make an appearance to be part of a big milestone for the show, in this case Renée and Barrett’s real-life departures. Her scenes with Nell carried so much emotion for the characters, who’ve had a rocky but close relationship for so many years, but we know they must have involved even more emotion for Renée and Linda. What an incredible experience for Renée to have worked so closely with such a legend. It was also a reminder to viewers of how lucky we’ve been to enjoy both their work for so long.

Memorable Moments

  • How disorienting to see ECO apparently supplying Deeks’ wardrobe with what looked like his own Faherty sweatshirt.
  • Surfer Deeks and the whole gang filmed at my little neighborhood beach in San Pedro. Too bad I’ve been away or I would definitely have stalked them walked over to play paparazzo.
  • Nelverine, Nellosaurus, Martin Atticus Deeks, Martin and Grisha, Eric’s Ununoctium, the WonderTwins. Harimoto and Gemmill were definitely out to set a record for nicknames. It added another delightful layer to the episode, as each one carried the history of its origin and felt particularly intended for us long-time fans.
  • Sam: no texting while driving! You need to set a better example.
  • I so wanted Beale to finally acknowledge that he owes Deeks a share of his business. Even a miniscule fraction of a percent of equity would be worth a fortune and would be incredibly helpful to our struggling couple. A missed opportunity to save the bar. I mean, the guy is driving a car with a base price of $393,000!

Things to Come

That’s a wrap for Season 12. Let’s take a moment to celebrate that we will be gifted with a Season 13, and then we can dive into conjecture about what it will bring. Will Linda Hunt come back full time now that COVID seems to be coming under control? Will she at least appear more regularly? Is Kilbride her new foil, taking the place that Granger held for so long? He was issuing orders to change out the fancy frosted windows in Mosley’s old office, so it sounds like he’s planning to be there more often. And she was making sure her antique weapons were returned to their proper storage, so it looked promising. (See this TVLine interview with Gemmill for more about the finale and next season.)

What will Nell and Eric’s official departures mean to the team dynamic? A natural shift would be to move Fatima to Ops, which I’d welcome, but it would leave Rountree without a partner. Giving him and Fatima that nice scene in this episode really made it feel like they’re intended to continue as partners, so perhaps we’ll have a fresh face in Ops instead. Either way, we’ll have one less character overall which moves us closer to our old dynamic of a core four plus Ops and management. (I do think they should give Rountree- and if she continues in the field, Fatima- desks in the bullpen.) I also hope to learn more about what drives Rountree. He’s a good guy and I want to know him better.

And who knows? Since neither Nell nor Eric were killed off, we may very well see them again in the future, perhaps for episode #300. I will also continue to remain optimistic, like Charlie Brown with Lucy and the football, that we’ll finally get a “Deeks, M.” to learn more about our favorite character’s backstory. (It will only have been about six years since Shane Brennan promised us a “Deeks, M.” episode for Season 8.) Who knows, maybe that’s the episode ECO is writing (a girl can dream). (Of course, the only backstory Gemmill mentioned was about Callen’s childhood. Sigh.)

This episode overall felt like a dry run for an eventual series finale. Learning how it would feel to say good-bye to characters we’ve loved for such a long time can only help us prepare for that eventual good-bye to the show. But since that’s not going to happen for another decade or so, let’s not worry about it quite yet. Instead, let’s congratulate them on completing Season 12 under incredibly difficult circumstances.

Thank you so much for all your support and great comments all season long. I’m sorry I had limited time this year so couldn’t participate in your fantastic discussions, but I always enjoyed hearing your thoughts. Keep them coming one last time in the Comments below. Did you enjoy this light-hearted episode? How did you feel about the big returns and departures? How do you feel about Season 12, and what do you hope for in Season 13? Also be sure to come back later this week for one last entry from Deeks’ Surf Log and Kensi’s Journal. I can’t wait to see you back here in the fall. Have a happy and safe summer!

About Karen (287 Articles)
wikiDeeks Writer & Assistant Editor. I never wrote for fun before... until my ECO-obsession. Now I love to analyze any and all aspects of the best character on television.

212 Comments on Review: NCISLA “A Tale of Two Igors” (S12E18)

  1. I hate it when I can’t check my facts but I think Hetty’s earlier orphan/agent was Sullivan, we learned about him having been killed after Hunter was blown up. I know we’ve moved on but the ‘history’ of the show is shrouded in vagueness, if not mystery. The spin off episode of NCIS had Gibbs and McGee on Los Angeles. They met Sam, Kensi, Nate and Beale. Gibbs had to find Callen. Macey was in charge, she had covered up Gibbs killing the man who murdered his family. Callen got shot. First episode of Season 1, they had moved to a new office and Hetty was in charge. So who recruited Sam, Kensi and co? Did Hetty just recruit Callen for CIA not NCIS? When did Hetty take over OSP? Does it matter? They are certainly loyal to her even if she didn’t assemble the team.

    Are we supposed to believe all Hetty stories? She told the Comescu lady her father died just before she was born and her mother shortly after. She was brought up by family. I’ll buy that, but how did she get into all the secret squirrel stuff? She once said that it ‘found her’ but how? How did she fit her film making exploits with her CIA stuff? Where did she get her money from? How is she so well connected. You get my drift. She certainly is a mysterious figure. I don’t see her as malicious, sometimes misguided. As the boss she does have to make tough decisions. In Season 5 I’m willing to believe she sent Kensi to Afghanistan purely to protect Jack, not to separate Kensi and Deeks. True they probably did need separating at that time.

    It was easy to assume she recruited Deeks as a replacement for Dom, but he was still alive at that point. I guessed Deeks caught her eye as some sort of misfit, but what was she doing poaching from LAPD? Oh yes liaison. In ‘Citadel’ Deeks said he had been investigated by the Citadel Organisation for six months before being offered the NCIS job. I wonder when he found that out? Not in the bar when Hetty gave him the papers. I think I’ve strayed into the ‘writers not knowing backstories’ territory. Every answer brings a new question.

    Hetty is definitely an important part of the show and her absence is one of the reasons it has lost it’s way a little. Having her ‘in the wings’ didn’t really work. We don’t have to like her. We certainly don’t like her secrets, and keeping information from the team. Everyone keeps information from the team, I’d like that to change. She has been missed, it will be interesting how she deals with Kilbride.


      • I think my last post might have come across as Hetty bashing, I didn’t mean it like that. I try to respect all opinions, people can think what they like. I like facts. Facts shouldn’t lie. I try to get correct names and events from the correct episodes. It is so easy to look too hard and get bogged down in details. Sometimes the facts are contradictory. I think we are supposed to believe Hetty put the team together, I think maybe not, but who cares? I think the writers have made Hetty so mysterious they have confused themselves. The fact remains the team would do just about anything for Hetty. It might be because they are terrified of her, I don’t think so.

        Callen being one of Hetty’s ‘orphans’ may have been a bit of an afterthought, an important afterthought. It seems she knew his mother Clara. Did she know the background of the other children? So many questions.

        I liked your description of the team as ‘dysfunctional people who are basically society outcasts led by a tiny but fierce lady’. They’ve all got their issues and baggage to some degree, some more than others. So yes, they are dysfunctional, they have to be, it would be boring if they weren’t. I think some people got hung up on the society outcast part. I can see why, but other than Deeks being rejected by LAPD, it’s the team that have done the rejecting. They have chosen to live in a world where they don’t tell people what job they do. Cloak and dagger, whatever. The job does set them apart from society a little bit. They are a collection of odd bods who struggle, and sometimes fail, to work together.

        Roll on October 10th.

        Liked by 1 person

        • Well said, Well said. I choose to think Hetty put the team together for a good reason, and it definitely shows. The team loves her, and she loves them. She may not say it exactly, but she does care about them.

          Also, Dani is back on set today, if anyone wanted to know.


          • Absolutely! Hetty cares about her team, as a good team leader should. Sometimes she gets it wrong, like the FLETC debacle, but at least she tried to help Deeks. Now if she bought the bar…..

            Yes I just saw DR on Instagram, I don’t know who the bloke was with her.


  2. Nutterbutter // July 19, 2021 at 5:57 PM //

    I know it’s been a long time since I commented here, but since the new season is started shooting I felt like I need to leave my thoughts and expectations for season 13 l refrained from posting new comments so not be sound like a broken record but I’ve enjoyed the discussion that’s been going on here. For me, season 12 was not their greatest one was there were a lot of misses than hits, but I’m grateful for their hard work under the circumstances (the Kessler storyline, the lack of Deeks screen time and showing he was incompetent, the Russian, the repetitive stories, Hetty’s absence, Nell in charge. for me it was Kensi centric season more than Callen we saw her in the field and off-field she got two storylines (Kessler & pregnancy) she expressed her opinion and feelings about every single topic.

    So fingers crossed that S13 they will be able to give us something new and along waited.
    From ECO’s comment about black clothes and DR’s insta story looks like she’s going to a funeral. So I hope it’s not one of the original cast or it could be a fake funeral as part of a disguise.

    I’m still hoping for Deeks, M, and I’ll keep asking for Deeks’s background story till the show ends.

    Broken record I know, But I hope they end the Kessler Plot without hurting Kensi and repeat the Sullivan’s and Afghanistan storylines all over again.

    I know Callen is supposed to be the lead of the show but I wish they could give us something differeknt other than the Russian stories and his love triangle.

    I for one looking forward to see Hetty & Kilbride running the OPS and how it’s gonna play out.
    I don’t mind the partners swapping as it gives us more interactions and makes us see new aspects of the characters.

    There should be a real discussion between Densi about their Job and their life without NCIS before deciding to adopt or having a baby.

    I want to see Deeks being supported by his team and have his back and Kensi chooses him over her job.

    That’s it for now, thought the rant will take longer, but maybe it’s for the best.

    Jessie, K


    • I can agree with most of these. (and from the way those BTS videos looked, it definitely looks like an undercover op, everyone is signed on for Season 13.)


    • Nice to see you back Jessie. I tried to take a break from posting, but boom there was another one. So I just kept going. I like your comments, you write what I think, which is a bit scary lol.

      Still can’t comment on Season 12, but I am looking forward to Season 13. There are the obvious changes in Ops. I watched ‘Getaway’ last night, I still think Scott Grimes, Dave from ‘Red’, would do a great job there. It will be interesting how Hetty and Kilbride work together, if they do. I hope they don’t try to recreate the Hetty/Granger relationship. I like partner swaps within the team but I’m not so keen on partnering with outsiders. Kensi looked way too happy working with Sabatino. I think I wrote that somewhere else

      I saw ECO and the black pants. My thought was ‘Lawyer Deeks’, I was happy about that. Didn’t think about a funeral, but yes, it could be. Still wondering who the guy is with DR. Kensi let him drive! Does look interesting.

      I’m fed up with the Kessler storyline, and I haven’t seen it yet. Yes I hope Kensi doesn’t get hurt when it resurfaces. I wouldn’t mind seeing Deeks being the hero and saving the day. Might be a bit cheesy though.

      Most people seem to be fed up with the Russian storylines, no doubt I will feel the same. Callen’s romance with Anna doesn’t interest me much either.

      Yes I’m still hoping for a ‘Deeks M’ episode. I would like Densi to discuss things outside work, and not just do what Kensi wants. I think it’s interesting that Deeks seems incredibly passionate about catching the bad guys, yet he is the one who considers alternative employment. I’m not sure his current thinking on the topic though.

      Most of all I agree wholeheartedly with wanting to see Deeks supported by the team and Kensi choosing him over the job. Now that certainly would be a change.


  3. Now I know, the guy with DR is Clay Cullen, a stuntman. Just got more interesting. Doesn’t Dave Olsen do ECO’s stunts. So……


    • Nutterbutter // July 20, 2021 at 5:07 PM //

      Same here Patricia I missed commenting and agreeing with you, but as they say great minds think alike LOL.
      First off to answer your question about the guy with DR, as per the social media he is Chris’s stunt guy as he has been before for the show. So maybe they are really swapping partners for some reason.

      As for David being ECO’s stuntman, you stand corrected but I if recall ECO said before in one of his commentaries “I think IA ep ” that his brother was not available so they brought someone else. (Oh god I missed their commentaries).

      I’ve to apologize if we ruined S12 for you or we came too negative that you get fed up with the Kessler Plot before watching it. But like you, I believe we have mutual preferences and agreement you will hate it too. But I’m really eager to hear your thoughts about it and the whole season really.

      I couldn’t agree more; I hated seeing Kensi enjoying her work with Sabatino, Fatima, or even Sienna more than working with her husband.

      Ok, no offense here to all Callen’s fans but haven’t we kinda beaten the idea of adding to his backstory to death, in comparison to other characters we already know tons about him and his family even the families of his GF & EX- GF for crying out loud.

      I still really want Deeks to receive the recognition and the respect that he deserves from the Team as a whole and especially Kensi.

      Don’t worry it’s not cheesy at all, I love heroic Deeks saving the day at the end of the day he is the knight with the shining armor at least for me, “Chessy I know”

      I really wish the TPTB to hear our thoughts and give us a season that would satisfy all the fans whether they are Deeks’s fans, or Callen’s, or Hettey’s, and fill the gaps with solid stories that answer the questions that we have been dying to figure it out.

      Jessie, K


      • Nutterbutter // July 20, 2021 at 5:52 PM //

        Sorry Patricia I’m so sorry I didn’t mean to say it like that I was meaning to say “Yes, that’s correct” but my laptop choose to write for me arghhhh Technology.
        “As for David being ECO’s stuntman, you stand corrected but I if recall ECO said before in one of his commentaries, “I think IA ep ” that his brother was not available so they brought someone else. (Oh god I missed their commentaries).”
        Sorry again


        • Thank you for answering my ‘stuntman’ question, I was like a dog with a bone on that one. I remember ECO saying Dave was out of town for the ‘Internal Affairs’ stunt. These little snippets are working, I’m intrigued by what’s going to happen. So Kensi is partnered with Callen, okay.

          It’s my decision to wait for the DVD’s, just as it’s my choice to read all the reviews and comments. I enjoy it, so there’s no need to apologise. You haven’t ruined Season 12 for me, quite the opposite, I’m looking forward to it. There were a lot of positive reviews. We had a discussion recently about Season 8, still my favourite season. I think I liked it because for half the season Deeks wasn’t humiliated and got some support from the team. Last night I read the reviews of ‘Getaway’. Everybody seemed to think it was a terrible season. Most of the people commenting then aren’t commenting now.

          About Callen, well he is the man main and he does have his fans. I have to admit he is well played by CO’D. I’m not a fan. To be fair I’m not Hetty’s biggest fan but she does bring something to the show, I missed her. Sorry but I don’t think I would miss Callen. As you say we’ve had so much of his backstory. For me he doesn’t have any redeeming features. The only thing I’d like to know about him, is why he has a problem with Deeks. I could go on, and on…

          I don’t think it’s too much to ask, episodes giving all the team a chance to shine and satisfy all the fans, answering some of the many questions along the way.

          Don’t worry about your laptop interfering with your comments. I get things wrong all the time. I can’t even blame technology. So often I reread what I’ve just posted and think, that’s not what I meant. I think I’ve got this one right.


          • Nutterbutter // July 21, 2021 at 4:17 PM //

            You got it right, totally agree. S08 was good especially as you’ve previously explained before that Deeks was getting some kind of support from his Team (Except Callen IMO).

            Also, you’ve mentioned how Kensi gave him the recognition that he deserved for being there for in her worst and taking all her frustration outta him, which by the way IMO was a bit justifiable as she’s been through a lot and had a lot in her plate (Her injury – PTSD – Therapy – Sullivan) but at the end of the day, she appreciated Deeks and his support. Something I can’t say she did this season. she was always angry and argue with him even when he tries to support her or pushing her not to lose hope and to be optimistic even in his darkest hour (losing his job & selling the bar to buy her dream house) & to think about it most of the issues she was angry with him are related and affected them both not her only. Hope we see some change in her behavior in S13.

            But to be honest, My favorite seasons of all the time are both S05 & S07. Both seasons at least for my were heavy on Densi & we get the many faces & aspects of My favorite Character and the layers of Deeks personality.

            Liked by 1 person

            • Of course favourite season isn’t necessarily best season, I like to think the best season is always the one they’re filming lol. I enjoyed seasons 5 +7 too, for the same reasons as you. I got the impression in Season 12 Deeks was continually beaten down, with no support and little respite. Even his moment of glory was denied him. Yet we were supposed to have sympathy for Kensi and her inability to get pregnant. Different from Season 8.

              I’m not sure what makes a good season. I’d like to see wall to wall Deeks episodes where he’s the hero and treated well, but it wouldn’t make a good season. A good balance helps, a nice arc, no Russians. Still looking forward to Season 12, oh yes Season 13 too.


  4. Because I’m insanely bored waiting on Season 13 premiere hints (there’s only 3 hints that there is so far: Sam and Roundtree teaming up, Kensi and Deeks probably on a undercover op, Kensi possibly paired up with Callen, though, that’s debateable right now since) (A BTS pic of Chris with Linda would be more interesting then all these hints! Though, that would probably be too spoilery), I’m gonna post this:

    I went back to Top 10’s after Season 8 (cuz there hasn’t been 15 good episodes since for me to rank), so I only did a Top 10 for Season 9, and here they are:

    #1, Goodbye Vietnam (For very obvious reasons)

    #2, Mountebank

    #3, Se Murio El Payaso

    #4, Can I get a Witness? (hated the ending, I’m sure you can guess why)

    #5, This is what we do (200th episode)

    #6, Liabilities

    #7, All is bright

    #8, 2 part Season finale

    #9, The Silo

    #10, Vendetta


    • I haven’t seen any pictures of Kensi and Deeks together for Season 13, but there was one of Kensi and Fatima. I’ve only seen Deeks on his own, does that mean the team rescue him lol. Perhaps somebody could get Linda Hunt into Instagram, taking selfies and stuff.

      I thought you might raise the question of Season 9. I had a complete blank about the entire season. My excuse was that I only watched it twice. I’ve almost finished re-watching Season 8, next week I will reach Season 9. I’ve only looked at the titles as a bit of a reminder so this is going to be a bit hit and miss.

      #1/2 A Line in the Sand/Ninguna Salida (Two powerful episodes together)

      #3 Can I Get a Witness? (Not the best Deeks episode, but I’ll take it)

      #4 The Silo (Not sure if I loved it or hated it)

      #5 The Monster (Did Hidoko not like Deeks?)

      #6 Party Crashers (Just for the scene with Deeks and Roberta, nothing else)

      #7 Goodbye Vietnam (How did I forget Hetty went to Vietnam?)

      Sorry Maria, that is the best I can do. Not that I didn’t like any of the other episodes I lust can’t remember enough about them.


  5. I’m with Jessie on season 12, definitely more misses than hits. Like I said before, I don’t think they’ll be able to let the Russia or Kessler storyline go. Both were the center of season 12 and even though the show is notorious for letting storylines bleed out to nowhere, those were too big not to follow up on. Joelle, Anna (Katya?) are still out there and so is Kessler (not to mention Kirkin’s empire). I think we’ll see a lot of repetitiveness in season 13. For me, season 12 showed us that they have run out of original storylines completely.

    I don’t think we’ll see a real discussion between Deeks and Kensi about life-after-the-job-and-with-a-family any time soon (I wish!). They already sort of stated they are going to take a break from trying to get pregnant. If it does happen, it will be the last episode when she announces a pregnancy and he’ll announce new jobs. There’s no other way out of that storyline.

    I think the shot of Kensi with Callen’s stunt guy, btw, seemed like an undercover op in progress; however, after having fans complain about not having Deeks with Kensi in the field for an entire season, not a good start letting that particular clip out on social media, lol! (Though glad to see DR’s hair pulled back from her face again, yay!).

    I stand by my original statements, I hate Kensi being in the field with anybody else but Deeks because that’s where the magic is. She treated Deeks horribly while he was in FLETC but was very happy galavanting around town with Sabatino and whoever else she was partnered up with while he suffered alone. I have never fast-forwarded so fast and so much.

    I also wish Deeks would be shown and treated with more respect, both from his team and his wife, but I have my doubts. He has been type-cast as the comic relief for the show and I don’t think it is going to change in its thirteenth year. I think Kensi needs a hard reset. Don’t get me wrong, I LOVE Kensi, but this “I am the job versus I am Mrs. Deeks” needs to stop. They’re not 25 anymore. And after all the unconditional and unwavering love, support and understanding Deeks has shown her, he has earned some in return.

    I’m also done with Callen and his drama, GF, ex-GF, GF’s family, GF’s prison friend, ex-GF’s father, etc etc etc ect…..pfff…… I mean, all that time could have gone to other characters’ backstories.

    I know there are people who like Fatima and Rountree, but I am with Robbie on this: They are going to force them on us whether we like it or not, and – for me anyway – they don’t click with the team and are flat actors who are just not credible as the characters they are portraying. I know a few toddlers who could take Fatima down in two minutes. I don’t find Rountree likeable and the constant “banter/flirting” scenes between them are annoying as h*ll because they have zero chemistry and it is beyond obvious they are meant to re-create Densi. Please, don’t take personal offense anyone, this is just my opinion. If you do like them then happy watching!

    I agree with Patricia also, I don’t quite get the team’s loyalty to Hetty. She has left her team hanging too many times (with her disappearance to Vietnam for instance) and shown disregard for their safety and well-being (Afghanistan for instance).

    I’ll comment on Afghanistan below, it’s always been a sore point with me, but the whole Vietnam thing for example; if you – as a leader – need to go on a mission, you let your team know and assign an interim leader. She’s never done that. She just ups and goes. Too many secrets and too much keeping information from the team that has shown to have dire consequences for their lives. Robbie said it well: “Mama Bears don’t send their cubs off to take shots at their former lovers…or cast them out if they’ve been broken in the line of duty”.

    And where did she get all her millions? Was she part of the gold-smuggling Vietnam operation? Did she somehow get a cut in whichever capacity she was serving at the time? Apparently, she not only has millions in cash at her disposal, but also real estate, yachts, airplanes, etc. This was a great line from Patricia: “I think the writers have made Hetty so mysterious they have confused themselves”. I think the writers have done that with all the characters, haha!

    I don’t think Hetty put the team together that personally and specifically, with the exception of Callen. Deeks has stated he was recruited out of the LAPD. But why? Because he ratted out a dirty cop? Didn’t exactly make him stand out. Kensi joined to uncover the truth about her father’s death and Sam was a SEAL. And there were Nell and Eric, but they were never really stand-outs. Not for me anyway, but I know they had their fans out there.

    I agree with Robbie that Hetty is a fascinating character but she is not all that is good and righteous, as he put it. She doesn’t keep the cost of the mission into consideration versus the benefits in mind, in fact, she often simply doesn’t seem to care about the cost. And she taught the team nothing about respecting each other, i.e. the way Deeks is treated (or should I say looked down upon by Sam and Callen) is the prime example.

    She is a master manipulator and master manipulators know how to keep people tethered to them emotionally. But I do agree that without her the team does not seem centered and/or focused. They’re like keys without their keychain holding them together.

    I still disagree with the terms ‘dysfunctional’ and ‘society outcasts’. In this life, everybody is dysfunctional in their own way. Deeks certainly was no social outcast, he had a very happy dating life, it seems! He was anything but. Sam was married with 2 children. Kensi was engaged to be married. The job sets them apart but so do hundreds of other jobs in that field (and many other fields for that matter).

    I don’t know why people assume I don’t want a Deeks, M. episode. I do!! All I am saying is that soooo many questions and storylines have been left open, it’s going to be near impossible to unpack everything into 1 episode and I’m afraid it will end up being something flimsy that will only confuse, bring about more questions and doesn’t do Deeks the justice he deserves.

    Lastly, a bit of re-hashing: With regards to Afghanistan, someone said something along the lines of “Hetty is supposed to send them to catch the bad guys”. That’s not what she did with Afghanistan. She sacrificed Kensi to protect someone who – NINE YEARS PRIOR – turned his back on his Navy team, his country (he renounced his American citizenship), and his fiancée.

    Not only did she violate numerous foreign and domestic codes of conducts, she completely threw Kensi to the wolves. She failed to inform her of her details of the mission (which I know happens a lot but this one was personal and Hetty knew it) and didn’t care less of the enormous personal shocking blow Kensi was dealt when she saw her fiancée whom she had thought dead for years was alive and well (and married with children as we later found out). Disagree with me all you, but those are the facts.

    (Then she shattered her again by assigning her and Deeks to protect Jack when he was back in the US as opposed to giving Kensi the courtesy, care and consideration of taking her aside and letting her know where they were going and who they were protecting).

    With Kensi being captured by the Taliban, she then had no compunction of letting the rest of the team go over there to almost be killed, including the fact that Deeks had to waterboard a blind man (which is so against all he stands for and haunted him for years) to rescue the love of his life.

    (And all this because “Hetty felt they needed a break from each other”…..? Uhm…, not really. That’s what transfers to a different field office are for. Also, why would they need a break? They’d only just gone on their first date).

    And as far as speculating: I love it! I love speculating and over-analyzing and taking every little detail apart! But not everybody does and that’s okay. But don’t knock the people who do, please, lol!

    Rant over, thanks everyone! No hard feelings, I hope!!


    • You can’t beat a good rant at the weekend M. What else would you do? Don’t answer that! Not going to talk about Season 12, I’ve done that enough and I don’t know what I’m talking about.

      I’m not expecting any real Densi discussions, it’s not what they do. Just bits and pieces at work, at least they won’t have Nell interrupting them. I would be happy to see Kensi pregnant in the series finale, not before.

      I keep trying to avoid all the spoilers and BTS stuff. It sucks me in every time and I always get it wrong. They are little tasters to get us interested and they’ve worked with me. I don’t mind partner swaps within the team, I like to see the team working together. I agree Kensi and Deeks belong in the field together. It might be my imagination but Deeks seems to be alone in the field quite often. Definitely don’t like to see Kensi so happy in the field with other people, especially when she treats an unhappy Deeks the way she does, as you say. I guess I will be fast forwarding too

      The whole question of Deeks being treated with disrespect. It really should change but I’m not expecting it. So many people have said much the same so many times, he is the kindest, most grounded of all of them, but routinely treated like dirt. I guess that is why I am 100% team Deeks and to be honest I don’t like any of the others too much. I don’t have to.

      Then there is Callen, it isn’t so much that I don’t like him, it’s probably worse than that. I don’t find him interesting. I know I should, he’s brave and skilled, difficult childhood and everything. He can’t find himself a place to live, or did he? Bit of a stereotype and I’m not fond of stereotypes.

      I don’t have an opinion on Fatima and Rowntree, as I’ve said before I’m trying to keep an open mind. It’s not easy.

      About Hetty, well we could go round and round for ever. We don’t have to like her but I think she does bring something to the show. Mischief, subterfuge, secrets, manipulation, I didn’t say it was all good, but she’s interesting. She’s not a stereotype, the most unlikely bosslady you’re ever likely to meet. She does belong ‘in the office’ where they can keep an eye on her, not gadding about in warzones. I think she does care about the team, in her own way. I also think TPTB rewrote history with Hetty putting the team together. She wasn’t around when we first met the team, but she seemed to know a lot about Callen and Sam working together. Another mystery.

      I can live with the ‘dysfunctional team of society outcasts’ probably because I didn’t take it to literally. In many ways they are an ill-matched bunch who shouldn’t get on together, actually I’m not sure they do, lol.

      Not going to argue the Afghanistan issue, I’m not 100% sure the all facts are right, but for the most part I agree.

      I think we all speculate to some degree, though I keep trying not to. I don’t like to over analyse either, seeing the wood for the trees and all that. Feel free to dissect all you want, it’s great that we all have a different perspective. Learning from each other’s point of view is what it’s all about, isn’t it?


      • You are so right, nothing like a good weekend rant!

        Yeah, that is actually also another reason I am not a Callen fan; I just don’t find him that interesting. The whole thing about him not being able to find himself a place for example because he is simply too scared to become emotionally attached is a bit over the top for me. Nothing to indicate he was that traumatized.

        Millions of people have had horrible childhoods (Deeks!) but he was a grown man when Hetty finally found him a house (where did he live before, btw?) and he still didn’t put any furniture in it but preferred to sleep on the floor and…eat of it until Joelle bought him a dining set….? Hmm…

        He was a foster kid. So? Pretty sure Deeks was too after shooting his father because his mother didn’t protect him. And Kensi was on the streets for a year. Again begs the question: What on earth did Hetty do with/to him when she got him that an emotional state that is so deteriorated he feels the need to eat and sleep in a completely empty house….?

        Many people on many many tv shows (and in real life!) are dysfunctional or come from a dysfunctional background. Still does not make them social outcasts.

        I know Hetty was not around when we first met the team, so there goes the theory of her specifically putting the team together (great catch, btw, thanks, totally forgotten about that!). It’s interesting that, during these discussions here, we seldom address Sam (apart from him leaving his children after Michelle passed and wanting to rip Deeks’ comm out). For me, Sam is just kinda there. He says his lines, shoots a certain amount of people, blows something up, and that’s basically it.

        I probably will continue to dissect, lol, one of my specialties, or crosses to bear, whichever way you see it, lol!

        And I do like hearing other people’s point of view!! Never a boring moment, haha!



      • You are so right, nothing like a good weekend rant!

        Yeah, that is actually also another reason I am not a Callen fan; I just don’t find him that interesting. The whole thing about him not being able to find himself a place for example because he is simply too scared to become emotionally attached is a bit over the top for me. Nothing to indicate he was that traumatized.

        Millions of people have had horrible childhoods (Deeks!) but he was a grown man when Hetty finally found him a house (where did he live before, btw?) and he still didn’t put any furniture in it but preferred to sleep on the floor and…eat of it until Joelle bought him a dining set….? Hmmm

        He was a foster kid. So? Pretty sure Deeks was too after shooting his father because his mother didn’t protect him. And Kensi was on the streets for a year. Again begs the question: What on earth did Hetty do with/to him when she got him that an emotional state that is so deteriorated he feels the need to eat and sleep in a completely empty house….?

        You’re right, Hetty was not around when we first met the team! Great catch, thanks! Totally forgotten about that. So there goes the theory she hand-selected her team.

        Many people on many many tv shows (and in real life!) are dysfunctional or come from a dysfunctional background. Still does not make them social outcasts.

        I probably will continue to dissect, lol, one of my specialties, or crosses to bear, whichever way you see it, lol!

        And I do like hearing other people’s point of view!! Never a boring moment, haha!



      • For some reason, my comment showed up twice. I don’t know why! It’s a mystery……


    • Callen as a character is completely stuck, and has been for the majority of the show in my view. Every once in a while they’ll dangle something in front of us that might actually show progress, but rip it away again. He’s a compulsive lone wolf, horrible team player…you name it. Rather like Hetty in many ways. He’s also the only one who could be classed as dysfunctional or an outcast…the rest clearly are not. It’s a shame. Chris O’Donnell is clearly capable of showing character growth in the same way they had McGarrett grow in Hawaii Five-0, but for whatever reason they won’t develop those kind of plot lines.

      I also agree Kensi needs a hard reset. One thing they never quite dealt with was how she pushed Deeks away during her rehab yet let herself get totally sucked in by Sullivan. I don’t remember if he did this or not, but one thing Deeks would likely do as a cop is run Sullivan through the system to see just who he was (and he might have…haven’t seen that arc for a bit so I might not be remembering when he did). They’ve made Kensi too much “one of the guys” (as in Callen and Sam), and that holds her character back. They had a great opportunity after Mexico…when Kensi should have seen what Deeks’ loyalty to the team almost cost both of them. There could have been a fantastic moment when she could have called Callen out for falling for Mosley’s story…but it didn’t happen. Instead Deeks goes back to being everyone’s punching bag and Kensi if anything gets more macho.

      As for Hetty’s background, I don’t think she was an orphan at all. I think she was one of the rich Ivy League types who were attracted to the CIA in the late 50s and early 60s…say the second child of New England gentry (which would account for her money and many of her attitudes). Hetty clearly doesn’t come from a deprived background at all, and it would give her the emotional distance to operate the way she does.

      And not only did Hetty fail to tell Kensi the truth about Afghanistan, she failed to tell Granger. And Granger was also in the field and in the line of fire. And once again Deeks had to save them by figuring out who the old cleric was and getting there in the nick of time.

      I, too, would like to see a Deeks, M. episode, but like M I think it’s too little, too late. I’d be happy at this point if he turned his bar into something like Molly’s on Chicago Fire or Pride’s bar in NCIS NO…which I think was his intent from the beginning. Let him go out on his own terms to a place that gives him comfort and a sense of giving back to a neglected part of the community. There’s a dignity there that Deeks has certainly earned…even if he has to do it on his own. Not that I want the demise of Densi, but it’s about time she made room for what he wants out of life instead of mocking it at every turn.

      Just my not-so-little weekend rant.


      • There is literary nothing I can disagree with here. Well said, Robbie, well said.

        Kensi seems to have become more and more macho (as I said before, her personal appearance has not helped either; not a fan of the new hair cut, she seems to be over-exercising and undereating at the same time, and not loving the wardrobe -shoes- either). DR is naturally so beautiful, what happened to our tough but still sweet and vulnerable Kensi?

        At the same time, they have turned Deeks into her – this is going to sound tough – whipping boy. He doesn’t stand up for himself, he seems to cringe inward whenever she snaps at him, he seems afraid to touch her, he constantly apologizes for something he never did wrong to begin with, and always ends up giving into her tantrums. What happened to our strong but unconditionally loving (safest husband on television) Deeks?

        One of my biggest pet-peeves is that Kensi does this to Deeks in public, in front of other people, in front of the team, in front of her superiors; making fun of him, telling people to ignore him or to not encourage him. Who on earth can (or would want to) withstand that emotional pounding day in day out? Deeks shakes it off but, IMO, nobody can withstand that for that long; this is not a healthy relationship anymore, television or not.

        I think the demise of Densi is inevitable if they want a baby. To date, we do not know what happened to the bar. Apparently, it was bleeding money last season. Why, we also do not know. They made the mistake of having Callen say they survived a global pandemic in the last episode even though they choose to ignore there was ever a pandemic during the entire season (!). A well-run, money-making bar would be a great option for Deeks (but please re-name it) but it sounds like it’s on the verge of bankruptcy. He can always go back to prosecuting and she can take a different position within the Navy. But if they want that baby, Densi in the field as we know it, will be gone.

        Mexico was indeed a fantastic opportunity for Kensi to show that she was and would always be Mrs. Deeks (fiancée at the time) but she chose the job instead, once again. As did the rest of the team. And when season 10 started, it seemed nobody had learned anything because they continued down that same path.

        And you made the astute comment about Fatima and Rountree being forced on us whether we like it or not, which to me has always been nothing but a poor and failed attempt to faze Densi out.

        Callen (and Sam) has been stuck for ages. He is just going around in circles (see my response to Patricia).

        Hetty’s background was also very well described. It is very obvious she does not come from a deprived background. She lacks the insight (and care?) of emotional consequences on others. And the amount of rare objects in her office alone could feed a small country, imagine what she keeps at home!


  6. I have a theory as to why we didn’t see Hetty in the backdoor pilot: She was off doing something at the time, then when she heard of Callen being shot, she came back early, then while he recovered, she moved the team to their new office. Also, I also think that Macy was just her temporally replacement while she was away. She still ‘hand picked’ her team, no canon change there.

    People show signs of being traumatized in their own ways. It might not always be visable, or something we can understand, but people show it in their own ways, same with dealing with grief, people deal with that in their own ways.

    I have my own theories to what Hetty did with Callen in her care, like taught him to fight, how to respect authority, and other things.

    You all might not believe it, but I like Kensi’s new look. Doesn’t make her ugly at all. It’s just a look that Dani wanted to go with.

    Just because it doesn’t look like Hetty didn’t come from a bad childhood, doesn’t mean she DIDN’T have a bad childhood. (I have my own theories on that, even wrote a few fics on her past.). She was in the spy life for a very long time, who knows what bad stuff happened to her in that time, like, maybe a lot of betrayals, and finding out the world can be a cruel place for well anyone! As for all that rare stuff she has, I have theories that they were either gifts, or stuff she bought. As for all that money she supposidly has, I think she earned some of it, and got most of it either from undercover missions, and I think some of it was gifts from important people. (maybe one of her undercover assignments was a bank robber. Chuckle chuckle.)


  7. Nutterbutter // July 24, 2021 at 5:05 PM //

    First I’ll go with Hetty yeah she is mysterious and has that super spy vibe especially with Granger & Mattias and I missed her in OPS and of course, Nell will never replace her or her charisma but with that being said Honestly I’m still holding a grudge against her because of the way she treated Deeks after his torture and expressing her willingness to let him go if he is not acting as he has been before, and during his healing and trying to figure out his way to adapt with his surroundings she took Kensi away from him and sent her to Afghanistan and left him with no explanation and leaving him with the guilt that eating him up and thinking that she was sent away because of him despite she was the one to go for it with her note, he even was willing to leave his liaison position and retune to LAPD just to get Kensi back.

    And when they left to save Kensi she instructed Sam to keep him away and outta the loop as he would compromise the operation which is an oxymoron as he was the one who saved the day by the end and proves that his head and his heart were in the right place.

    Some would say she redeemed herself after she what’s done with him in IA despite she kept the whole situation under the radar till they notice that they’ve been followed all she’d done was to swap the partners and create more doubt in Kensi’s mind that they can’t to be together.
    Then she goes and do it again and put her team in danger to catch the mole by putting Kensi’s life in danger again and sent all her team members to jail and give whiting the evidence that could incriminate Deeks,

    then leave the team in their time of needs after Michelle and Granger’s Death and the whole team was falling apart and under the teeth of one the most horrible and condescending person that I can imagine to run the OPS (Mosley)to rescue someone she lifted in Vietnam 20 years ago who Does that??? And to make the matter worse after the whole team went to save her she only expresses her worries for Callen and what’d happen to him despite her whole team was sent to Mexico with her liaison officer “the one she’s chosen” was fired and Sam being Shot and Densi relationship was falling apart, her only concern was Callen as he was like her Son What ?????? she supposed to protect her team and support them in their worst I know Maria will disagree and I respect that and would really like to hear her thoughts about that as she has more understanding and has the grasp of the depth of Hetty’s character more than I do.

    One of the thing that I love and admire about Deeks that he not easily intimidated or afraid to stand up for any authority figures who tries to use their power or manipulation to achieve what they want like when he did with Mosley and he did it with Granger but also when he faced Hetty with her actions after sending Kensi to Afghanistan or when after she returned and refused to send her to work in the field, or when Kensi got kidnapped by Sullivan
    I so appreciate how Deeks stays true to his values and isn’t afraid to stand up to those in authority when he’s given questionable orders. It’s a very admirable and appealing, quality.

    Just to clear that up, I don’t want Densi to have a baby or adopt right now as Patricia & M said before that will affect the due working in the field. All I’m saying is that they need to sort that out before they try to have a baby as Deeks said before they should’ve some sort of agreement about their future without any manipulation from Kensi and give him a straight answer to these questions as she always finds an excuse to leave these questions unanswered which by the way have been 5 years since he asked her about leaving the job and find another career.

    as I recall in S10 he said he missed being a lawyer and she made fun of him despite he proved himself being an exceptional lawyer like he said, wasn’t she the one who said life is so short and the proposed to Deeks, Then asked him how long will they keep doing this after the Silo, and then she asked the same question after better Angels .like she only waits for the for something major to happen to her to think about the topic and then confuse him (and me to be frank)with her answer. And when he tries to ask the same questions she dismisses him and accusing him of being self-centric or trying to compromise her identity or too optimistic. But for real it’s a legitimate question to be raised especially in this phase of their life.

    What’s really get on my nerves is she needs always to be right. They always have to do things her way. I don’t know why do we’ve to list all the things she has been through to sympathize with her and justify her actions) her father died, she was abandoned by her fiancé her partner was killed, she suffers from PTSD, or the treatments affect her mood). well she is not the only one who’s suffering, and let’s face it, Deeks has got more than enough of his own demons whether it abandoned by his family, or being abused in his childhood, he was an exotic dancer to pay for his college or being betrayed by his own coworkers in the police force, his partner or handler killed(Jess Traynor). So he has his fair share to be pissed off the world, but we don’t see him go now and then throw tantrum on her.
    They really downplay his hurt and his pain to the point that it will not exist.

    Jessie, K


    • Most people I know of only look at Hetty in a negative way. I look at her in a positive light and try not to judge too quickly and try to understand why she does what she does. One of my big theories is that she took losing Granger harder then anyone knew (they were partners, and she knows perfectly well just how hard it is to lose your partner.), add what she went through in Vietnam and witnessing her team get blown up only a couple months after returning to work, who knows where her mentality has been the last few years. And that’s what worries me. I just wish there was proof in the show’s canon that shows she’s been trying to deal with what has happened the last few years in a positive way.


      • RobbieC // July 24, 2021 at 6:43 PM //

        Except per show canon didn’t she try to kill Granger at least once in the past?

        I don’t dislike Hetty, but I think they’ve taken her down a dark plot route and many of the things she’s done to “her” team (especially Deeks, but Kensi as well) are unforgivable. I don’t think Deeks has been personally loyal to her for some time…his main loyalty is the team. And as he proved in Mexico he’ll follow them to the end, not matter how little they deserve that loyalty. There are times when the writer side of me thinks one of the reasons Callen dislikes Deeks so much is he knows deep down Deeks is a better person and he’ll never be able to measure up to that standard. I also think that explains in part Sam’s dismissiveness of him: he simply can’t understand how someone who isn’t a SEAL can be as honorable and resilient as Deeks is day in and day out.


        • That first part was never actually explained. (that came across as more of an accident then anything.).
          We all have our opinions, I choose to look at her in a nice understanding way, and you all choose to be critical. Nothing wrong with our difference in opinion.


      • Nutterbutter // July 26, 2021 at 12:24 PM //

        You know what Maria your theory may hold water, but the writers need to expand and explain that in their stories.

        By the way that’s why I asked for your viewpoint as you you’ve more understanding of the character than I can not claim that I do.

        Let me be honest I like, no I adore how you and all the fanfiction writers portray Hetty in their stories she is kind, caring, capable, authoritative in a good way, to summarize it she is like the mother hen protecting her cheeks.

        And I wish the writers in the show to illustrate that side of her more, that’s why they need to give every character the chance to shine and explain their action instead of concentrating on one side of their personalities or pit the spot on one character and neglect the others.

        ECO did a really fine job with Hetty in “Mother” he showed us something we rarely see in Hetty’s.

        So I blame the TPTB for damaging her good image but to be honest, they didn’t ruin only her they ruined Kensi and Deeks also. So I hope this season they could rectify their mistakes and give the characters the credit they deserve.



  8. So about Callen, I’ll try to be brief but I can’t promise anything. As RobbieC says, Callen as a character is stuck. Apart from finding a family he hasn’t moved on, he hasn’t done anything much. When we first met him I think he had been living in cheap hotels, maybe lodgings. Then he moved in with Sam and his family. He was up all night keeping Sam awake. Not a thoughtful or considerate man then. Effectively he was homeless, unlike the majority of homeless people he presumably had a decent salary. Hetty negotiated the purchase of a house, one he had lived in as a child. He reluctantly became a house holder, I couldn’t say home owner. I guess he had a good reason to avoid having a place of his own. When his house was compromised and he had to leave, Deeks let him live over the bar, rent free. I can only guess but I would imagine renting accommodation in Los Angeles would be expensive. So two years later, or whatever, when Deeks is in financial trouble Callen wasn’t able or willing to help. Not a generous man then. He doesn’t seem to have shaken off his rootless childhood, still sees himself as some sort of victim. He doesn’t do anything to help anybody, other than Sam or lost boys. I’ve always assumed Hetty ‘rescued’ Callen as youngster at some sort of crossroads, and steered him away from a life of crime, towards the CIA. It’s not that I don’t like him, I don’t find anything interesting or likeable about him. Again as RobbieC says Chris O’Donnell is capable of showing character growth.

    As a pairing Sam and Callen, can be amusing. I quite like their banter, cruel but fair, as the saying goes. Sam is completely different from Callen, but I’m not a fan of his either. At least he has done things. A career as a Navy SEAL, married with two children and became a legend. Insufferably smug and judgemental. I will never forgive his remarks to Deeks just before the torture business. What gave him the right to say those things and why was he never brought to book for them? Moving on. He is routinely told how much he is respected, a good honourable man, why wouldn’t he believe it? On the other hand Deeks is routinely told he is useless, why wouldn’t he believe that? I digress. It’s not all bad, he has occasionally shown he cares for his team mates, not just Callen. I think deep down Sam does actually have a heart. I still think he should have been with his children after Michelle was killed.

    I think I have muddied the water a bit talking about Hetty not being in the pilot therefore not putting the team together. It’s just that the NCIS episode popped up on my TV a few weeks ago and stuck in my mind. I think the point is it was NCIS not NCIS:LA. At that time NCIS:LA was in a state of flux. Can I say that we can all believe what we want to believe because there is not really anything to prove it one way or the the other.


    • RobbieC // July 25, 2021 at 8:50 AM //

      Pilots don’t always bear any resemblance to the actual show because there’s always the doubt they’ll be picked up (look at Red, for example). I don’t tend to pay a lot of attention to them in terms of character backstory or continuity because of that.

      Callen was never homeless, at least not when he was with NCIS. He always lived in cheap, long-term hotels and such, and the impression we’re given is he did so for the anonymity they provide (but they also attract law enforcement attention…something TPTB seem to have overlooked). My assumption was they were trying to show his penchant for blending in and being able to disappear at a moment’s notice. You see some echoes of this with the Gray Man episode.

      Sam…yeah, I think he has a heart, but it’s got the SEAL trident stamped on it. I also think TPTB put so much effort into creating SuperSam they don’t quite know how to back up and show him as human and vulnerable (although Frank Military should be able to do this based on his experience with The Unit). This is especially obvious when it comes to Deeks. Like you, Patricia, I have never forgiven Sam for what he said to Deeks prior to the torture, and for someone who’s supposed to be honorable his failure to correct his mistake (beyond the brief and seemingly-forgotten exchange in the hospital) is a permanent black mark on his character for me. Rather like Hetty throwing both Kensi and Deeks to the wolves at different points.

      Let’s go back to FLETC for a moment. Deeks going there is somewhat paralleled by the experience of Sebastian in NCIS NO. But that show handled it far better. There was a special agent vacancy for Sebastian to fill BEFORE he went, and it was revealed later that LaSalle worked with Sebastian extensively (on the range and in fitness stuff) prior to FLETC to make sure he was ready to go. The team supported him the entire time. And then we have Deeks, who somehow goes from fit and very tactically competent to Larry (The Three Stooges) at FLETC.

      I bring up NCIS NO because there seems to have been some bitterness in that fan community that NO was cancelled but LA was not…and they point out many of the plot and character flaws we’re discussing now. I have to wonder how much LL Cool J’s star power has to do with LA surviving another season, honestly. NO certainly has its flaws (and the final cast was much weaker than what they had in season 2), but the team spirit was much stronger and on the whole the plots were reasonably varied (they had their fixations from time to time, but nothing like the never-ending Russia thing). I also feel the show brought in the stress of law enforcement work and some of the emotional pieces better than LA does.


      • I take your point that Callen wasn’t homeless inasmuch as he didn’t live on the street, but as a grown man he didn’t have his own place. It might have been that his possessions would fit into a luggage locker so he felt he didn’t need permanent accommodation. With NCIS he stayed at the boatshed or slept on a couch in the bullpen. For a time he lived with Sam until Hetty made him buy a house. Not sure if it was for Sam’s benefit or Callen’s. Whatever, it wasn’t a healthy arrangement, but it suited Callen. I understand when he was doing his secret squirrel stuff with the CIA he had to disappear at a moments notice, but as I see it he was just taking advantage of Sam.

        I never saw much of NCIS NO, not sure why but I never got into it. I do seem to remember there was more of a team spirit about it. Pride seemed to care about his team and I always thought Deeks bar was supposed to be a Californian version of Pride’s bar. I always hoped that I’d got it wrong and Deeks did get support from his team when he went to FLETC, but I guess ‘m going to be disappointed when I get to watch it.


        • RobbieC // July 25, 2021 at 7:54 PM //

          It took me a bit to get into NCIS NO, but once I did I found I like the show quite a bit. It did suffer from some significant cast changes (losing LaSalle pretty much knocked the wind out of it, and I don’t think it every really recovered), and in some cases the new characters weren’t as good as the ones replaced (I preferred Brody to Gregorio by a wide margin, and the departure of Sonya was also a blow…she had great chemistry with LaSalle).


  9. I’m having a good day, because DR took the time to check out my IG page and liked one of my Densi throwback posts.

    People absolutely deal with grief and trauma in different ways, it’s just that Hetty has never really shown she came from trauma or deprivation. The only way she has been seen dealing with whatever it is she went through later in life, is by taking it out on her team, putting them in constant danger rather than protecting them.

    Nobody knows exactly what Hetty did with Callen in her care or why she ripped him away from what seemed to be a loving and happy foster family (or how she even got the right to do so) at such a young and influential age. In my opinion, she didn’t do a very good job.

    She turned him into an emotional loner who lacks the capability to even so-much-as rent an apartment or buy a house, commit to any relationship, and looks down on people he feels are (for whatever reason) beneath his level (Deeks), and who he feels he has the right to treat likewise.

    He expects 100% loyalty from his team including Deeks when it comes to the people he does care about, such as his father and sister (Deeks reminded him numerous times they’d be committing treason) without giving one iota of the same consideration to them in return.

    And she certainly never taught him to respect the people you work with and who put their lives on the line for you without giving it a thought (Deeks again). If that was Hetty’s doing, it leaves much to be desired.

    Many of the things Hetty has done when it comes to Deeks and Kensi are simply unforgiveable.

    We have no proof that Marcy was a temporary replacement while Hetty was away plotting something. Marcy just didn’t click with the team/audience so she was replaced with Linda Hunt. The team existed before her, there was no hand-picking. Those backstories about that were made up years after that.

    Pilots (pilot season) are never/seldom the same as what follows. Pilots (pilot season) are a merely tests to see whether or not a show will be picked up.

    Unless you are a CI, you don’t earn any money from undercover missions; they are part of your job. When you are a CI, you get a percentage of the take. For instance, if you play a part in taking down a multi -million dollar drug bust as a CI, you get 10% of the takings. Hetty was never a CI.

    I agree with Jessie, Hetty continuously throws Deeks and Kensi to the wolves. And also with the fact she goes to rescue someone in Vietnam after TWENTY years, just like Jack after NINE years without any consideration for her team. Where is that loyalty to the current present team?

    The show has turned Sam into some sort of a superhero, like Robbie said, and his humanity has suffered because of it. I also think Robbie brought up an excellent point in that Callen and Sam do not like Deeks because deep down inside they know Deeks is so much better than they could ever be. I think jealousy over the relationship/love Deeks and Kensi have come into play with Callen because he knows he will never be capable of having such (and this is due to what Hetty turned him into, I believe).

    With Sam, yeah, he definitely sees resilience, strength, compassion, and excellence in the field in Deeks, and cannot wrap his head around the fact he basically is as good as a Seal without actually being one. No excuse to treat him as a lesser person though. The pat on his legs in the hospital after the horrendous torture was not nearly enough, and he fell right back into the pattern of thumbing his nose at him after that.

    Like Patricia said, if people continuously praise you, you start to believe it. That is why I have such a hard time believing that Deeks shakes off all the put-offs and down-grades, humiliation, harshness, jokes at his expenses and being demeaned. There comes a time when you just start to believe it. Remember, he had an incredibly traumatic childhood. He was never that that secure to begin with. And then his own wife started in on him. Eventually, it all starts to eat away at you. Jessie is right, they cannot continue to downplay his pain. Something’s gotta give. Some people will say their healing comes from taking care of other people, but does merely pushes your own unresolved trauma down until one day it resurfaces because it never healed to begin with.

    I know some people like Kensi’s new look and good for them. It’s good to think different about things and people. We don’t all have to agree, lol. DR is naturally beautiful! All I am saying, she doesn’t need all the make-up (which Deeks hates anyway) nor her hair in her face on one side all the time (which is quite dangerous in the field as well).

    I know Maria is a big Linda Hunt fan and I just want her to know that I am not Linda Hunt bashing, I think we’re all just giving our opinion of what they have done with her character, that’s all. I think we all love and have the utmost respect for Linda Hunt (I know I do).

    Deeks will never be afraid to stand up for what is right and though he seems to shake a lot off (which as I said I do not believe; we saw an example of that in his hotel room at FLETC after he told Kensi he was struggling and she hung up on him), he never loses his moral compass or his integrity, but he has been through the ringer and season 12 was just too much.

    If they do decide to move forward with the baby, like I said, it will be the demise of Deni and it will have to happen in the series finale. There is no-way-no-how Deeks will bring children into the world with their current jobs. It has been years, as Jessie said, with him trying to get a definitive answer out of Kensi or at least a timeline. She should be there by now. Deeks is 43, Kensi is 38, they’ve officially together for 6 years and married for 2, how long is he going to let her make him wait?

    But I think TPTB know this will mean the show is going to end. They painted themselves into a terrible corner with the whole baby storyline. I know not everybody thinks Deeks and Kensi are the heart of the show (I do!) but I doubt the show will successfully be able to continue without them.


    • Just because we don’t see Hetty struggling on screen, doesn’t mean she’s NOT emotional when no one’s looking. WE all act differently when no one’s looking. Though at this point, I think we’re just repeating our opinions!

      I get it, you don’t like Hetty and I love her. I find her tough, caring, amazing, funny (her sense of humor is amazing!), and all around awesome, and I’ll defend her if I see fit to. I think she cares about her team very much, and you disagree.

      It might be easy to look at her first glance and think she only cares about herself, but to me, it’s not that easy. Yes, there’s a lot of unanswered questions about her past, and other things, but that’s what makes it fun to guess what her past might have been. (to me). All we know is what we see in the episodes, how our brains interpret what happens off screen is different.

      Years ago, back in 2014, I had no idea anyone so small could do anything gutsy, then I saw the end graphic for the upcoming episode The 3rd Choir (the end graphic was that scene where Hetty jumped out of that window), and I was like ‘WHAT?! How can someone so small do something like that?!’. Then I saw the episode itself. That’s when my fascination with Hetty started. (though, maybe I just have a thing for older people. Chuckle chuckle.)

      With this show, I think you need to look at it in 2 ways: What you see, and what you don’t see. What they say and what they don’t say. It might seem easy to just judge what the team does at first glance to some, but to me, it’s not really that simple in some cases.

      Yes, I can see that you respect the actress, I respect her too!

      And FYI, I think Hetty is the real heart of this show, she’s been with this show since Season 1, and Densi only got started in Season 2. Plus, it’s become a bit obvious in the last 3 years that this show is definitely lacking something without Hetty.


      • Actually, I was just agreeing with the other people on here regarding Hetty……nothing I said differs from what the others have said and repeated. All you have to do is look at everybody else’s comments. I’m not saying anything new…..shrug…..but okay……sigh….


        • RobbieC // July 25, 2021 at 7:51 PM //

          Yep. Hetty is an interesting character. But caring about all of the team? We will disagree here (Afghanistan and the aftermath of Deeks being tortured are both examples of, and I’m being generous, less than optimal behavior on the part of Hetty). And I’m surprised no one mentioned how she pushed Nate out of OSP and into field work. Hetty has her moments, and the character was much better written prior to the whole mole arc. Now the writing is a pale imitation. And if we’re taking seasons as the gauge for heart of the show, Callen and Sam must be there as well, along with Eric (even though he’s gone).

          One of the biggest flaws with blog format as opposed to message boards is sorting through this kind of stuff. It’s much harder to follow and track on a blog.


        • I know that. It just feels like everyone else on here has said the same thing about Hetty over the past couple of months, and you’re all allowed to think the same thing, and I’m allowed to disagree on it all.


  10. This would be one big snooze-fest if we all thought the same. There would be no point posting comments if we all agreed. We all have a different perspective. Most of us are Deeks fans first. Maria is a Hetty fan first and there’s nothing wrong with that, quite the opposite. Keep fighting Hetty’s corner Maria. M puts the show under a microscope, it works for her. Lots of inside knowledge too. RobbieC judges the the show from a writers standpoint and compares it with other shows. It’s all good. We can learn from each other. I see it from an outsider’s viewpoint, it’s fascinating.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Nutterbutter // July 26, 2021 at 4:18 PM //

      Well, Said Patricia, I couldn’t say it any better.
      I think every character or even actor has its basic, hard-core fans that will justify all their actions despite their flows.
      In NCIS LA we have Deeks who has murdered his partner & cover it up, has some anger issues that appear Cleary when someone treats the women in his life specifically or any women generally.
      Kensi is ambitious and chooses her job over anyone and her anger and frustration when she is not in a controlling position.
      Callen with his lone-wolf behavior and his trusting issue. Sam with his condescending attitude.
      Hetty and her many secrets and manipulative behavior.

      So As a Deeks fan, I’ll root for him and I’ll to defined him in every possible way and justify his actions even if they aren’t justifiable, exactly like you do with Hetty.
      That’s why (for me at least) I seek different reviews, and sites to know everybody’s reactions and understand where their point of views are coming from, and sometimes (only sometimes) I change my view after being convinced by other’s opinions.
      Even Deeks fans have different reactions & interpretations for the same episode or season.

      So embrace who you are and who you root for and don’t de afraid or coy to express your opinion
      Jessie, K


  11. Hi there, love seeing all the comments, some I agree with some not so much..but that’s what makes this interesting..all the points of view..watching Mondays NCIS La marathon shows, I miss the bull pen banter, when all 4 of them, Sam, calllen, kensi and Deeks. Just listening to them before eric blows the whistle for a case, just them kidding around…I miss kensi and Deeks as partners and their sexual tension before the wedding, the banter between Sam and callen, not worrying about Russia and who is dating who..looking at the old episodes, it’s actually exciting to watch…hope we see some of the old NCIS la come back this season..time will tell..


    • Absolutely Kathy, I think my default reaction to most comments is, yes…but. When it comes to re-watching episodes, I often notice something I haven’t seen before, just because of something someone has said. Equally someone has claimed something happened, I watch the episode and think, no it didn’t. It’s good to keep an open mind.

      I think Jessie is spot on with her assessment of the team. Like her I am protective of Deeks and I agree we’ve all got our own version of him. When it comes to other characters, the original team at least, I think it is their interaction that makes the show, regardless of whether we like them or not. I like to see the team working together, I like a bit of banter. Even if Hetty is the Wicked Witch responsible for all that is wrong in he world (I’m joking Maria) I still prefer an episode with her in it, to one without her. Yes, I would like to see some of the old NCIS:LA back.


      • I agree. (and yes, I know you were joking.)

        I tried to get myself to rewatch a few Hetty less Season 9 episodes last year, but I couldn’t do it. To this day, the only Hetty less episode I’ve even rewatched is Season 10’s The Guardian. (which was part 1 of the JAG reunion.). There HAVE been a few okay episodes without Hetty in them (like Better Angels), but in all honesty, without Hetty in the episodes, it not only feels like something is missing from the episode, but it also really decreases my chances of wanting to rewatch the episode in the future. (In this case, there’s only like, 13 episodes from the past 3 Seasons that I even have remote interest in ever rewatching in the future! And, that is what I consider ‘bad’)


  12. Since everyone appears to be around during the weekend, I’ll put up my latest fun discussion post:
    I know not everyone cares for Season 1 all that much because of Deeks only being in 2 episodes, but to me. Season 1 is pretty underrated. I’ve grown to love Season 1 more over the past couple of years due to well. The last few dumpster fire Seasons making me feel nostalgic for the fun of the early Seasons.

    I actually only did Top 10’s for the 1st 2 Seasons during my first rewatch, but I later expanded my Top 10 of Season 1 to a Top 14. And here they are:

    #1, Hand-to-Hand (obvious reasons)

    #2, Brimstone (first Christmas episode!)

    #3, Pushback

    #4, Search and destroy

    #5, Callen, G (Season finale)

    #6, Burned

    #7, Identity (Series premeire)

    #8, Full Throttle (One of my favorite filler episodes ever: Callen in traffic school, Hetty riding that Segway, just so awesome)

    #9, The Bank Job

    #10, Ambush

    #11, The only easy day

    #12, Fame

    #13, Kill shot

    #14, Random on purpose


    • I remember sitting in an exam room looking at the questions, unable to answer a single one. The teacher hadn’t told us about any of it. It feels the same right now, I don’t know. I can’t remember what episodes of Season 1 I’ve watched. I think I dipped in and out, but didn’t get into it. ‘Hand to Hand’ must have been a dipped in day, because I really remember that one, ‘Fame’ too. In mitigation I was still hooked on NCIS at the time. Switching to NCIS:LA was mostly due to Deeks, but partly due to NCIS disappearing from my TV for a while. I remember ‘Identity’ and the one when Dom was shot. Oh yes, I remember the one where Callen found out about his sister. It is possible I have seen all of Season 1 but not in order and nothing has stuck in my mind. I’m not quite sure what that means. I didn’t hate it otherwise I wouldn’t have dipped in, but for whatever reason it didn’t draw me in. I did like Dom and Nate, but I do remember enjoying the different vibe that Deeks brought to the show.

      I don’t have Seasons 1-3 on DVD, but they are shown on a loop here. At the moment they are almost halfway round. I suppose I could go and get the Season 1 DVD, or wait for it to come round again.


  13. Then there is the whole vexed question of ‘Deeks M’ as noted on Instagram. Whoa! So many thoughts to be thought there. Realistic me thinks if we were going to have one, we would have had it by now. Optimistic me says yes please. The thing is, there is just so much that a single ‘Deeks M’ episode will not be enough. I would settle for a number of Deeks-centric episodes where we learn about his past. Yeah about that….

    We could learn more about Max Gentry, where he came from etc. For me he is just an alias we have met twice, the second time Max Gentry lite. I’m probably alone but Artie the homeless guy fascinates me more, we have seen him more often. I liked Ray, Deeks’ childhood pal, we met him once, now he’s in Witness Protection. We probably could learn a lot from him. They moved on, met up again, moved on again. There is also Roberta, now she could tell us everything. Most people can’t forgive her for not protecting her son, she can’t either so why should I? Yet I do. For me the missing piece is Gordon John Brandel, Deeks father. He has a lot to answer for. Yet in ‘Personal’ Deeks somehow seemed sad to learn his father had died. We know little about him, nothing good, yet he had a huge impact on young Deeks, or was it young Brandel? What happened after the shooting, why did Deeks become a lawyer, not a criminal. Did somebody step in? Just so much we can only guess. We all have our own ideas.

    We can only guess the truth behind the whole Deeks killing Boyle issue. There is clearly something we haven’t been told. Hetty and Kensi may well know, a piece of information we haven’t been privy to. Just so much we don’t know, not sure we ever will.


    • Hmm. I certainly hope you all get your big episode because of how long this site has been asking for it.
      What do I think? Well, It’d be nice to know more about Deeks. Course, there are more things that’d I rather get answered next Season as well. Like, where has Hetty been and questions related to that.


    • These are all questions I have posted before…..sigh……

      We do know why he killed Boyle. He had a habit of raping, beating up, and killing teen prostitutes. He was about to do the same to Tiffany.

      Same with the Deeks, M. episode. Hope we get one, but, like I said, too much happened over an almost 12 year period to pack it into one episode, and it will probably leave us more confused and with even more questions…..sigh again…..


      • Same here. We know exactly why he killed Boyle. No mystery there. And Roberta could tell us *her* version of everything, which might not actually BE everything. Don’t forget…she was out of his life for an extended period. I doubt she was on vacation with Hetty in Bermuda…

        At this point there’s really no reason to do a Deeks M episode, especially given the issues with continuity we’ve seen in the last few seasons. And as for most of these questions, I doubt TPTB have any serious answers, either. Deeks started as a secondary character, meaning there might have been some motivational notes and stuff like that but I doubt there was an in-depth background. And given ECO’s ability and willingness to improvise, it’s hard to say what was actually background and what he might have added to a scene and remained in place. Great as an actor, but it can wreck havoc with backgrounding.


  14. I can appreciate the negativity. I mean, why bother? Why bother with any of it?


    • I think that sometimes as well. Kind of why I try not to let negativity overpower me. Because there’s just got to be a light at the end of the tunnel. And because there’s just got to be a reason to hope for good episodes. Might sound kind of naive, but hey. It keeps me going and keeps me speculating (and it sometimes gives me good fic ideas)


      • Yes you’re right Maria. Thank you. I’m positive by nature and I feel bad for those who aren’t. I don’t take myself too seriously and I try to post comments that are amusing. Okay I try, often fail. I don’t mind if people disagree with me. It wasn’t even the negativity that upset me, if people feel that way that’s fine. It was two consecutive comments starting off mocking, in my mind at least, a point I raised, which I still think is valid. One little poke wouldn’t have bothered me. Truth is none of it should have bothered me. It really doesn’t matter.


        • I’m so sorry you feel that way, Patricia. I hope it wasn’t my comment, it certainly wasn’t meant to mock you or anyone. Just my opinion, that’s all. Sometimes I feel people just repeat my comments instead of responding to them (I brought up the point about the Deeks, M episode many many times for instance) or attack me for having an opinion.

          But then I realize that we are all trying to deal with what has happened to this show and especially our beloved characters. Like Maria said, we are all looking for that light at the end of the tunnel. Season 12 has brought us more sadness than happiness (my opinion, nothing more!……sigh…..that’s all!

          Don’t feel bad for people who are “negative” ; all it means is that they have a different reality and perspective. Just like people who are positive all the time have a different reality and perspective. I don’t feel bad for them, that’s just who they are. How boring would this world be if we were all exactly the same! 🙂

          Hope you feel better soon! 😉


          • Yeah, I know none of us set out to upset anybody and I guess it was one of the times when something trivial gets to you. I only posted the Deeks M comment because I had just noticed something on Instagram, and if you read it again, we probably think much the same. The thing that stuck, and this sounds so petty, was the Deeks shooting Boyle issue. Yes we do know why, but actually, I’d love to know if it was self defence, an accident or, heaven forbid, cold blood. I’d like to know if LAPD really processed the crime scene and what evidence turned up years later to make them arrest Deeks. I’d like to know what evidence that had at all, etc etc. I just felt it was a fair comment that got shot down in flames, then again by the next commenter. It is a mystery to me. If you do have the answers, please tell me.

            I think I’m back to what passes for normal now, sorry to make a fuss.


            • I get it. People label me as “negative” because I tell it like it is or rather; the way I see it. I like to put things under a microscope and question a lot of decision-making. That is the writer in me. I should not be labeled, attacked, or critized about that. Nor do I need anybody to feel “bad” for me because “I am negative”. Nobody knows a thing about me personally, it’s nothing but judgment based on some comments I made about one TV show.

              And sometimes it feels like the comments I made are repeated often, as if I was never the one who brought the issue up to begin with. We started this immense discussion (after the last episode’s review) because I wondered how this show would play out if Deeks was the treating Kensi the way she treats him. And it went on from there.

              Anyway, I think you bring up excellent questions with regards to the Boyle situation. They were just missing from your initial comment. I, for one, would love to have known the details of how that all went down. A cop killing another cop is no small issue, after all. And he kept getting nailed by Whiting over and over again. From the beginning, there has to be an FOP rep involved, etc. There is no way she can keep coming back into his life and harassing him the way she did. Also, there were zero witnesses when he confessed to her, so for her to come back and ‘black-mail’ him with that knowledge makes no sense, as he could easily deny ever having made such a confession.

              Then again, so many questions remain, the entire Deeks shooting his father at 11 situation for starters. Imagine cops and CPS workers barging into the door. Who took the gun? Was it tested for finger prints? Was he arrested as a juvenile? Was he placed in foster care? Was Roberta arrested for child endangerment or neglect? The list goes on.

              That is why I often say one Deeks, M episode will do more harm than good. On the two subjects above alone, you could play out half a season.

              Same for Kensi. What happened to her during her year on the street? A year is a long time for a 15-year-old girl if you have a safe home to live in. Or did her mother abuse her that bad she’d rather be homeless? Where did she live? In a tent, under a bridge? How did she sustain herself? Did she eat? What did she have to do for food? And most importantly; her mother never reported her missing? She was 15. An entire LAPD force wasn’t able to find her while she remained in LA?

              I’m probably being too negative or critical again, but those are just some of the things I’d like to know. And the list goes on……

              Glad you’re being back to what passes for normal now, haha! I don’t think anybody knows these days what normal is anymore, lol!!

              Have a great rest of your day!


              • Oh dear M, I think I’ve upset you now, sorry not intentional. I wasn’t talking specifics with the Boyle issue just things we didn’t know and I couldn’t understand why you latched onto the only thing we did know. Water under the bridge now, we have to move on.

                I can see an issue here, please bear with me. Most recently I’ve been in ‘discussion’ with three writers, yourself, Maria and RobbieC, and I know lots of other commenters also write. I’m not a writer, but it’s not for the want of trying. Do you detect a hint of envy here? The problem I have, with NCIS:LA fanfiction at least, is language. I’m English. I understand American fairly well, but I can’t write it. Sometimes I watch the show and I have no idea what they are talking about, I get it eventually. I don’t know what a FOP rep is. I know it’s all English but we use it differently, not just different spelling. Maybe I try too hard to make my comments ‘read right’ and miss my point. Other Brits comment here, so perhaps it’s just me.

                If you read the words I posted on 26th July you will know how I feel about other people opinions, we all see things differently. For example, my take on Kensi’s time on the street is totally different from yours. I would defend your right to your opinion even if I didn’t agree. Looking too closely doesn’t work for me, it stops making sense and I’d rather just sit back and enjoy the show. I just enjoy it more when they treat Deeks right.

                Can we just embrace our differences?


                • Aaaawww Patricia, don’t worry!! I love your comments and I always read them. Of course we should embrace our differences and different opinions! That’s what makes this all so interesting!!

                  I stay away from fan-fiction because some people who write it (not everyone, of course) tend to write it in heavy favor of their favorite character and that paints a whole other picture in their head as to who they actually play/are in the show and gets them upset if someone else has a different take. But kudos to those who enjoy writing and reading it, if it brings you joy, go for it!

                  No worries about anything, Patricia! I’ve been to England once and the people I met were lovely. When I lived in New York (I am in LA now) my 2 best friends there were from England (Manchester and Cambridge).

                  Have a great day!!!


  15. I’m impressed. I’ve scratched out a few short stories, but I couldn’t write a novel. I have to finish the book I’m doing, I’ll let down too many people if I don’t. I’m sure you would do well writing for TV


    • Done the publishing thing, too, though I don’t stick to one area (done both fiction and non-fiction). I wouldn’t want to write for TV, though (that one’s all yours, M!). As I mentioned before, I use fan fic as more of a writing exercise than anything else. When characters are already done you can experiment with voice, plotting, how you make action flow…all kinds of things. Since they aren’t your characters it’s actually easier to mess around (at least for me…I tend to be very picky when it comes to continuity with my characters and novel plots, and it’s easier to just mess around when that stuff’s either done for you or can be framed as a kind of atmosphere like Miami Vice).


  16. I guess I’m just a wannabee writer. I came to the whole writing thing incredibly late. I failed A-level Eng Lit. I walked away from my last job after twenty years, stuff happened. Ought to have got another job but I’m just too old for the hassle. I thought writing would fill the void. It did but it wasn’t good, not the fiction anyway. With help from friends I started my book. The end was in sight when more stuff happened and I had to put it away. I’d just got it out again and Covid happened, I needed to travel to check things out. In the meantime I discovered wikiDeeks and fanfiction. It does get the ideas out of my head. As things stand I have a nearly finished book that I have no idea how to get published, it’s niche shall we say. I’ll keep looking for a publisher and I will get on the train. I just hope when it’s done people will enjoy reading it.


    • I’m a bit of a wannabe writer myself. I write a lot of fics, and I’m in the midst of writing an actual book that I want to one day get published myself.

      I’d enjoy reading your book.


    • All writers are wannabe writers. You never stop wanting to get better, to hone your craft. And if you do stop wanting to get better, it’s time to find something else to do. Writing is one of those things you just never stop doing because you need to do it. At least that’s how it’s been with me.


  17. In case anyone’s interested, got a little filming update:

    This is day 2 of filming Episode 3. (I have no clue of what Episode 2 could be at this point.). Got 2 notable clues so far: A BTS pic of a long, wavy wig showed up yesterday (interesting, in a way), and today, 1 of the crew members gave the title away: ‘Indentured’.

    (Funny, isn’t it? That this is the episode that’s showing some hints that I’m actually somewhat interested in? Lol.)


    • Got another update (Thanks to Chris O Donnell Fans on Twitter):
      Episode 1’s director is a familiar face, Eric Pot
      Episode 2’s title might be Fukushu (could be)


      • I’ve been looking at the bts stuff. Do we want to see our guys having fun on set or do we want clues about the episodes? Is it greedy to want both?


        • I want clues, my opinion… we see bits and pieces on Instagram … but I enjoy that, but then again sometimes in fanfiction stories , I go to last chapter to find out if my characters find there happiness. I still haven’t seen much with kensi and deeks as partners in season 13. I have seen Callen and Sam, kensi and Fatima. But not my two favorite characters kensi and deeks🤔I have high hopes. Thanks


          • I want both too, haha! But it is also “worrisome” (yeah, I am being negative again, lol) that fans have been begging for more Hetty and more Densi and we have seen neither……I am not watching any scenes with Fatima or Rountree, sorry, I just can’t at this point. We get BTS with DR and Callen’s stunt double, DR playing around with Fatima, and Deeks arriving by himself on set. I saw one post where DR was filming ECO playing around on park exercise equipment, but that was it. I know October is far away, but I say we deserve something after the disaster that was season 12, lol!


            • I don’t really care who posts BTS pics or vids, or who’s in them, TBH. (well, at this time, and some of them are kind of cute when I want a laugh) While it would be nice to see more pics with Linda and Chris in them, I also know that neither appear to want to be in many pics or videos ATM, and it’s something I have to respect. (last year, I went a bit crazy wanting to see just 1 pic or video with Linda in it, and it was a bit embarrassing. Plus, I later DID get confirmation that Hetty would be in the premiere in some way. And to top it off, a couple weeks before the premiere, that epic looking BTS pic from her driveway showed up thanks to Entertainment Tonight!) Guess what I’m trying to say is, being patient can get you somewhere. (also, these few pics or vids is just a tiny fraction of the actual episode.)

              (Plus, Hetty has been in every Season premiere of this show, so it’s 99% likely she’ll be in this one in some way or form as well. Also doesn’t hurt to have a little teaser as well, so here’s hoping TV Line, or Parade or Entertainment Tonight provides that before October 10!)


              • Here’s the thing. I watched Season 8 before I found spoilers or anything. Best season ever, well maybe. I didn’t know what to expect. Certainly didn’t expect Michelle to die. Season 12, didn’t expect Nell and Eric to move on. Haven’t even seen Season 12 yet. It’s best not to know. Yet I seek out every little bit of news, I read every review, keep looking on Instagram. Why is that? Should I get therapy? I look at the BTS shots of our guys having fun, it blurs the line between actors and characters. Then I see Deeks wearing ECO’s clothes. Oh dear! I think I need to lie down in a darkened room. It’s best not to know. First thing tomorrow morning I’ll be looking to see if there’s anything new.

                Yeah Kathy, I look at the last chapters of fanfiction to see what happens to Kensi and Deeks, well Deeks anyway. Can you get treatment for that lol?


                • I am pretty sure we all need treatment😂 for me my addiction is kensi and Deeks, that’s what got me involved in the show the banter, the sexual innuendos, and they are both gorgeous 😍everyone got their favorite..Sam and Callen are too into themselves, Russia ( over it) I am sure Fatima and round tree are fine actors..I’m just not into them at all..miss hetty, and will miss eric and Nell..( especially when they were working in opts) kilbride will be interesting…I know we don’t know what season 13 holds, but I want to see kensi and Deeks as partners and finding happiness…thanks


                  • I’ve had a look, nothing new. Yes you’re right Kathy, it is addictive. I’ve said many times I’m 100% a Deeks fan. Kensi and Deeks are a couple and it doesn’t seem right to ‘support’ one without the other. I’ll miss Eric and Nell too. Hetty left a big gap for a small person. I don’t care for the other characters so much either, but it is the interaction between the characters that make the show what it is. We can only wait and see what Season 13 brings, like you I’d like to see Densi happy together, just getting stress from the job. Backstory aside, I’d like to see some episodes with Deeks as ‘the man’ taking centre stage, rather than Kensi’s plus one. A little support from the team wouldn’t be asking too much, would it?


                • I do agree with you on that one point, Patricia, seeing Deeks wearing ECO’s clothes or the other way around, who knows anymore, lol! Or like I said before, both families in all those vacay pics and vids. All their kids (from what we can see) look alike. It blurs the lines. I think it’s part of the reason why physical contact between Deeks and Kensi on-screen has become awkward in season 12.

                  Both families spent half a Covid year on ECO’s ranch in Idaho, holidays and all. Then you have to go to work and make out with each other. I remember there was a video of SWO and DR ,and Sarah said something along the lines of “….and you do work with my husband every day….”. Blurred lines for sure. You need really really strong writers (showrunners/directors) for that and the show has lacked hugely in that department.


                  • I agree to a certain point about Eric and Dani, there kids are getting older, but they have done a lot of talk shows and they both say they are actors along with their spouses and the want to stay faithful to their characters and fans. I think they still should be able to hug, touch and kiss and not cross lines. I just want to see them happy again… just my
                    Opinion, thanks.


                    • You can show a lot of affection just with the right dialog as well, which the writers and show-runners for whatever reason have not be giving us the past few seasons. It doesn’t all have to be physical. In fact, many times it’s much more effective and has a deeper impact if it’s not. But for whatever reason those moments seem to have left the vocabulary of the show, and for me as a writer that’s a great loss. Especially since ECO is so good delivering those kind of lines.


                    • Same here, Kathy, Densi is my main reason for watching. I’m not talking about heavy love scenes, but hugs, kisses, holding hands, cuddled up in bed or on the couch watching TV, just the type of intimacy things that has been missing.

                      I’d also like to see personal conversations taking place in a personal setting, not in between flying bullets or on a stake-out, and this is where the COMM issue comes in. Sometimes they are talking about having a baby and all of a sudden Nell’s voice comes on. Does that mean that everybody is listening in on their personal conversations? It makes no sense and is kind of super annoying.

                      There were a few hugs in season 12, but always initiated by Kensi (and I feel they should be by Deeks for a change) and the affection part just seemed…

                      I want them back to the kind of “happy” they were. They’ve only been married for barely 2 years.

                      Does that make sense?


  18. I do like pics and vids and BTS, hehe! I know Maria feels she needs to respect the fact that it seems Linda and Chris do not want to appear in many, but I see it the other way around. They wanted this career, they wanted the fans, they wanted the big bucks, the big house, the nice cars, they wanted the fame; they should respect the fans who gave them all that. Just my opinion, that’s all. They all live privileged and luxury lives because of their fans.

    I’m not sure, Patricia, why you are only on Season 8? I have friends and family in Europe who are up to date in seasons. Are you in an area where it does not broadcast or stream? Just wondering, that’s all. And yes, I think we all need therapy, haha! I know I do, lol!! Lying down in a dark room actually sounds fabulous!

    My addiction, as if it was not clear enough yet lol, is Deeks and Kensi. I’m with Kathy on that one. Sam and Callen are too arrogant and self-absorbed, Russia; totally over it, Rountree and Fatima; actually cannot stand them, will not watch anything with them in it. Hetty has done some unforgiveable things to the team in my eyes, but I am curious to see how the show handles her return. They did a terrible job with her character in season 12. OPS is empty for now. Like I said before, Nell and Eric did this job full-time for 12 years, to have a field agent run up and down every now and again is ridiculous. If it is possible to run OPS that way, then what have Nell and Eric been doing for the past 12 years? Play on-line solitaire?

    I’d also like to see Deeks stand up for himself (since nobody else seems to) and grow a bit of a spine within his marriage. Kensi (though I still love her) needs to slow down with the ‘my way or the highway’ thing. Support from the team would be nice, but if it hasn’t happened after 12 years, how much weight will it carry if it happens now? How genuine will it feel? I know I could not shake off being treated the way Deeks has been treated for years and just ‘forgive and forget’.


    • I respect Linda and Chris with wanting to be private about being on set for the time being because if I didn’t, I’d go completely crazy waiting on either of them to be in a pic or video every day, and these days, I just need some kind of peace in my life.

      All I really want for Season 13: More Hetty, answers to Hetty, Densi to not be so baby addicted and to actually do happy things again so maybe I could stomach their scenes again without rolling my eyes and thinking ‘Oh brother!’.

      As for if I think Neric will be replaced, I doubt it right now. And it doesn’t really matter to me if they are, in honesty, I think the last thing this show needs is an even bigger cast then it already has.

      Fatima and Roundtree are okay, and kind of cute IMO.


      • Same on the replacement for Nell and Eric. Too late in the game and, for sure, the last thing the show needs is more cast members!


        • Agreed. They’re already forcing two awkward characters down our throats…we don’t need two more. I also agree with you, M, about the star stuff. Maybe some of it’s embarrassment for how last season went? I don’t know. But if you’re the main stars in a show, you kind of have the obligation to be out there.


          • Maybe you’re right, but 1 thing to understand is that Linda is the only Series reg without a social media account, probably because she wants to be as private as possible. Which I can understand, not everyone wants to be online as much as we are.

            Maybe everyone else just wants a mini break from social media, and maybe that’s why there’s not a lot of pics or vids from the usual cast members and that there’s more from the Rookies.


            • See my responses to Patricia and Robbie re. ECO ‘s and DR’s social media; personal pics and vids, etc.

              I think everybody has had humongous breaks due to Covid, (half a year to be exact: March to September for starters, and then again months before starting filming season 13). You know how many breaks I had from my job? Zero. And if I would have, I would not get paid huge residuals because I don’t have a show in re-runs.

              Sorry but not sorry. If you get paid that much money for doing nothing, you can find the time to give your fans something. Kudos to ECO and DR for doing so, though it being a bit too personal between the families at times, but at least they did. They also gave us their new projects and ECO the causes he strongly supports and believes in.

              If you choose a career in the spot light then you are….guess where…in the spot light. If you want the fame and fortune to keep coming, gotta give something back. You can’t just turn it off when you feel like it and then on again at your convenience and expect everybody to say ‘hallelujah’ when you do.

              Don’t mean to sound harsh….where are emojis when you need them, lol!


          • We definitely do not need two more. I wish they had taken the time to replace Nell and Eric properly with decent characters. Or character (Garcia from Criminal Minds comes to mind, although she might out-act a few cast members, haha!) and would have canceled out Fatima and Rountree. Never have I seen new characters as much disliked as these two. It boggles my mind why they renewed their contracts when they had the opportunity with OPS to do otherwise.

            And yeah, if you are the main stars, you have an obligation. If you do not want to or cannot be physically out there, there is social media. Especially if you want your fans to keep giving you the salary you get paid and the life you are living……ECO and DR have given us a lot of personal pics and vids (sometimes too much, see my response to Patricia above), but the rest of the cast has not seemed interested; however I bet they are interested in ratings, contracts and pay-checks. Not fair to the fans.

            I also think the network has an obligation if they want to keep their fan base. Whoever is running the show’s FB and IG pages, is doing a minimal and pretty bad job. I think WikiDeeks with this conversation is keeping everything going at this point, lol!


            • Not everybody wants to let everyone online into every single detail of their life, you know? If someone wants to limit their time on social media or be private about their life, then that’s their right to. Maybe the rest of the cast is more interested in the show then we know, but it’s not our job to demand actors to be more active on social media.

              During the summer, show’s FB or Twitter pages being less active then usual is normal, they get more active when the premiere date gets closer.


              • Most of these people are going to have teams handling that kind of thing for them. Some might do it on their own, but honestly it’s all coordinated effort. If nothing else their agent/agency would have someone handling the social medial stuff.

                The whole thing is a two-way street. Networks can’t assume or demand fans notice their shows if they don’t put some effort in. Same goes for stars. It’s probably more important for the stars…unless they want to go down as one-role actors. But given the number of venues for reruns and residuals, maybe they don’t care about that as much as they used to. After all, not every show is Gilligan’s Island.


                • With regards to Densi: It’s basically the same I response as to Kathy’s: I’m not talking about heavy love scenes, but hugs, kisses, holding hands, cuddled up in bed or on the couch watching TV, just the type of intimacy things that has been missing.

                  And ECO is great at those one-liners. Who can forget “Your smile is so perfect” for instance? Season 12 convos were high-jacked by Kensi’s relentless anger towards Deeks and him just bowing down.

                  I’d also like to see personal conversations taking place in a personal setting, not in between flying bullets or on a stake-out, and this is where the COMM issue comes in. Sometimes they are talking about having a baby and all of a sudden Nell’s voice comes on. Does that mean that everybody is listening in on their personal conversations? It makes no sense and is kind of super annoying.

                  There were a few hugs in season 12, but always initiated by Kensi (and I feel they should be by Deeks for a change) and the affection part just seemed…

                  When the pandemic hit, a lot of agents, managers, marketing people, publicists etc. lost their jobs. In Beverly Hills, ICM fired 200 of their agents in one day. A lot of these people are gone, so the era of having a team handle your social media is thereby gone, as is clear when you look at ECO’s and DR’s IG pre- and during-pandemic IG posts.

                  Unless you have Kardashian money, not many people can afford to keep that up. They do get paid well, but in comparison to other shows, such as Law&Order SVU where Mariska Hargitay gets around $350K per episode and the actors of The Big Bang Theory (a show my employer made!) where the main actors were paid 1M per episode, the actors on NCIS-LA are nowhere near that kind of money.

                  I do like you your comment with regards to ‘one-role actors’. ECO is branching out with his own company going into developing originals, DR has directed a small docu in Portugal but hasn’t really been in anything else or done anything else in the US besides NCIS-LA, I will have a difficult time seeing her as anyone but Kensi. Most likely, she will go the “spokes-person” route, LL Cool JJ has his music, Chris has a diverse acting portfolio, as has Linda. I’d love to see a Densi spin-off actually (and I have some ideas about that), but I don’t know if ECO or DR would be interested.


    • I’m still reading these greats points, nothing to to add, well not right now. Just to clarify, I’m currently re-watching, just onto Season 9. I have seen Seasons 10 + 11 just waiting for Season 12 DVD to arrive over here.


  19. M,I think you misunderstood what I wrote. Season 8 wasn’t the last season I watched, just the last one I saw without seeing any spoilers. Even so, I knew Kensi got hurt. It’s better when you don’t know what happens. Spoilers, well spoil the surprise but I still seek them out. BTS clips are different, they don’t tell us much but keep us interested, and frustrated.

    Social media, now there’s a thing, I don’t do it. I have a peep at Instagram quite often, never post. I have been known to look at Twitter but I don’t have an account. I don’t really have an opinion because I don’t do it. Are the actors supposed to be promoting themselves or the show? I sort of thought CBS should be promoting the show. I’m inclined to believe it is the choice of the actors to choose what they put or don’t put on Social Media. It doesn’t matter to me how much the actors earn. They create a show that I have enjoyed very much, that’s enough for me.

    As to what will happen in Season 13, no idea. They need a ‘specialist’ in OPS. Fatima is the only one with anywhere near the technical knowhow. I thought Dave from ‘Red’ would do, but Garcia from Criminal Minds would do better. The problem is, I agree we don’t need more characters. I’m so glad it’s not my problem. Kensi and Deeks well……I’d like to see them happy, fighting the bad guys together, not fighting each. Perhaps we don’t need to see them in bed, a hug is enough sometimes. I guess it was missing from Season 12?


    • I would prefer Sebastian from NCIS NO if they need someone in OPS aside from Dave. Garcia? No way.


    • Oooohhh….now I get it! Thanks so much for clarifying Patricia! I was having images of you on a remote island somewhere waiting for an airplane to drop off your box of NCIS-LA DVRs, haha!

      Yeah, wait till you get to season 12, you’ll see what people were complaining about, lol.

      It doesn’t matter to me how much they make either, happy for them they are successful in life too, all I am saying is that we, as fans, have earned something in return because, yeah, they do make a show to keep us entertained, but if nobody watched it, they would not have what they have or are where they are.

      Social media during Covid: If you want to stay relevant, you have to keep that up. CBS definitely has to promote the show, but if the show it not on, it is mostly up to the show’s stars to keep themselves current. Especially with Covid and the amount of streaming available. If nobody sees you anywhere for half a year, fans will go somewhere else.


      • Are you sure you’re happy for them? After all they have months off work. Are you sure they’re not promoting themselves? I’m sure they understand the situation completely.


        • Huh….what….? Why wouldn’t I be happy for them….?

          And….uhm….yeah….I follow their social media and the shows social media, so I am sure. Are you?


          • You just sounded envious that you had to work hard all through Covid and didn’t get a break. While they had months relaxing with money coming in. Perhaps I misunderstood, it happens. Sorry.

            When it comes to social media, I wouldn’t pretend to know anything about it. Just asking questions.


  20. New discussion post of mine:
    Season 2 was a pretty good Season. And in my first rewatch, it was the last Season that I used Top 10’s and started doing Top 15’s or 16’s.
    Here’s mine:
    #1, Special Delivery (Nell’s 1st episode)

    #2, Familia (Season finale, that team solidarity scene where they turn in their badges gives me chills every time I think of it!)

    #3, Human Traffic (Season Premiere)

    #4, Overwatch

    #5, Disorder (Awesome ending for a Christmas episode!!)

    #6, Personal

    #7, Absolution and Deliverance (The 1st Hetty centric episodes)

    #8, Rocket man

    #9, The Job

    #10, Enemy Within

    If no one really remembers Season 2, that’s okay too, no judgements from me.


    • I can’t do a top 10, but I’ll do my best

      #1, Human Traffic Deeks

      #2, Personal Deeks

      #3, Plan B Deeks

      #4, Borderline Deeks

      #5, Bounty Deeks

      #6, Disorder Didn’t remember the title, but nice Christmas one.

      That’s the best I can do, they’re the episodes I remember. Sorry if it makes me shallow and boring, I can’t help it.


  21. Today’s episode 3 filming update: What looks to be a big gun fight being filmed today.


  22. Question: What do fans on here and on Tumblr really think we’ll get out of the whole Kessler arc? Basically the only speculating I see on Tumblr is ‘is this where he’s going to show up?’.

    Can’t help but wonder what these fans really think we’ll get out of this.

    To me, this whole arc seems too easy to predict. (Someone or Kensi gets threatened, someone or Kensi gets captured, then Kessler gets taken down or killed.). Unless there’s some kind of unexpected twist in here, I doubt this arc will amount to much other then being predictable.

    If they really wanted to make this arc interesting, they would’ve really mentioned it in more then 1 episode instead of only really bringing it up in the 2nd to last episode of the Season.

    Unpopular opinion, but Frank Military hasn’t written a really good episode since Better Angels. (Code of Conduct was terrible, Raising the Dead was barely okay and mostly tedious, and the only thing I was really thinking about in Through the Looking Glass was the finale.), Unless he’s actually improved his writing over the summer, I’m not really looking forward to the next time he writes and directs an episode.

    I’m more interested in what’s going on with Hetty and Callen then this. (probably a given anyways, but at least THEY’RE more interesting then this!)


    • Honestly, as complicated and long the mole hunt was, it was a lot more interesting then this.
      We got some great episodes out of all that, great teamwork scenes, and plenty of bada** Hetty! What more can you ask for out of a great arc?

      The 1 thing that would make this stalker arc more interesting would be to involve Hetty in a big, positive way. (course, given that basically all of my ideas are too smart for the producers to consider, it’s possible monkeys will fly out of my bum before that happens.)


      • Frank is slumping. No question for me. The why is a different animal. Maybe he’s been asked to focus on specific characters.
        And Callen for me is dull. Deadly dull at this point. They’ve stalled the character out so much. What’s he gonna do; discover a previously unknown family member in Russia who slept with Joelle and now wants to marry Anna for Arkaidy’s money? It’s too late in the game to give Callen real growth unless they do what I suggested earlier.
        I know you love Hetty, and she was one of my favorite characters until the writing went south. Afghanistan really did it for me. If they could get back to Hetty prior to that it would make a huge difference for me.


        • I know I’m coming from a place of ignorance, but I think I understand what you’re saying. My feeling is that they tried to fix something that wasn’t broken. They know how to do arcs. The whole Janvier/ Siderov storyline was what I call an arc. Little teasers slipped in so you didn’t realise it was an arc until half way through. The Kessler issue is referred to as an arc, but from what I gather it’s a story that should have been a two-parter, except nobody wrote part two. Everybody waited for something to happen, then lost interest.

          About fixing what is broken, not so easy. Callen’s character has definitely hit the buffers, it wouldn’t hurt if they parked him in a siding for a while. Unfortunately it does seem he will be locking horns with Kilbride and of course he is the main man. I can’t remember what you suggested they do with Callen, but you’re probably right. Not going down the well trodden ‘Deeks M’ road, enough has been said already. Ideally they should work on Fatima and Rowntree, make the youngsters more interesting/likeable. I can’t comment more, I haven’t seen enough of them and I don’t know how they could do it anyway. I guess we’re all experts and know what they should do, but as viewers we know what we want to see.

          I’m famously waiting to get the Season 12 DVDs before I know what I’m talking about, but I got the impression there were some awesome emotional scenes, with lightweight stories overloaded with ‘Russia’.

          Before I finish. I’m still trying to place Sebastian from NCIS:NO. I realise the only male characters I know are Pride and LaSalle. There’s the one in the wheelchair or the thin one with glasses. Can’t think of any others. He must have been in the later seasons.


          • Sebastian was the thin one with glasses. A lab guy who became a field agent.


            • Thank you, I’ll watch out for him next time NCIS:NO comes round. Presumably he joined after I stopped watching, I don’t remember him


              • He originally worked with the coroner, but was with the show from the beginning.


                • So I should remember him, but I don’t. That is going to bug me so much. Tell me the coroner was a lady…..please.


                  • She was. CCH Pounder. Great actor who also appeared on the entire run of The Shield.


                    • Thank you. I’m still annoyed I can’t remember Sebastian, I would have watched a season at least, not just a single episode. In mitigation NCIS:NO isn’t shown so often here. On my TV tonight I can watch several episodes of NCIS, an episode of NCIS:LA from Season 2, but it’s months since NCIS:NO was shown. However I could watch Star Trek Enterprise if I want to see Scott Bakula.


        • Same with Afghanistan!


  23. More BTS clips, ECO and DR entering a house with guns. At least I think they were, can’t really tell. A bit frustrating really, like having a canape when you really want a steak.


    • Saw the same video earlier today.

      Also saw an Instagram post earlier from ‘cdscores’. Looks like they’re getting the opening credits for Season 13 ready. (here’s hoping there’s actually a recent or new Hetty scene in there this time instead of the same one from Season 9 that’s been used for 2 Seasons already!)


      • Yes I saw that on Instagram too. Everyone else gets a new clip each season, why not Hetty? Seeing the the Rick Tunell BTS shot from yesterday I had a mental image of Hetty and Kilbride hunkered down, shooting the bad guys. Well, NCIS:LA needs a new direction, lol. Perhaps the two of them should break down the door, shoot the bad guys and save the team.

        Liked by 1 person

  24. Just saw a tweet of the new TV Guide issue, and, there’s Hetty info in it!! There’s Hetty info in the next TV Guide issue!!!!!

    If I sound a bit hyper at the moment, it’s because I am!! I haven’t had much of a reason to look forward to the Season 13 premiere, and now I might finally have my reason to look forward to it!!!!

    (And it’s been a long summer and I’m very info deprived of anything remotely interesting of this show.)


    • Thanks to an amazing friend, I have the info:

      Hetty WILL be back in the office (yaaaayyyyyyy!!!!), and as predicted, things are definitely going to be tense between her and Kilbride. And it looks like that mission she was on last Season DID go south in some way, and she’ll try to resolve it on her own, (but as 1 can predict with this show and this team’s fierce loyalty to their true leader), and the team will eventually be all involved. Also, some familier faces might not be as friendly as we once remembered them. (Interesting)

      All in all, this sounds so much like Hetty and her team, and I’m now looking forward to the Season 13 premiere!! (yay me!)


      • Not really what the article says…….”….team’s fierce loyalty….”…(see prior post), it literally says ‘it will suck in the entire team’…….yay for original story lines, SMH….

        But I’m happy for you, you get your Hetty back!


        • The ‘fierce loyalty’ bit was my own words. Because we all know that when she’s in trouble, the whole team will rush to her aid, and I love that.

          I saw a screencap of the article. This all might sound a bit repetitive, but in all honesty, it’s better then another round of ‘ring around the rosy, Where’s Hetty?’ for another Season!

          (I only know she’ll be in the premiere so far for now, well, 99% sure. Future episodes remains to be said, but yeah. I’m feeling confident right now, and I love it!)


          • I think you will get your wish because the article says that ‘she is back in the fold for season 13’ and she will bump heads with Kilbride ( he outranks her ) who does not agree with her methodology. It says the first conflict between them is about the mission she was on during season 12 and the next one will involve old friends. My guess is you will be good for your Hetty fix, lol!


            • Just being a little cautious, because TV Guide has fooled me before when it comes to Hetty. Like back before Season 11 started when it said that she was back full time, and then there was the info last Season that said that she would risk her life again and that the team would come to her aid. (I know it was later revealed that they couldn’t film those scenes the way they wanted to, but that still stings, because I really hyped up that info!!)

              I think it’s telling the truth this time, but we’ll see.


              • Excuse me, should’ve said ‘Most likely to be telling the truth’, because odds are, the info is right this time.
                Still a lot of spoiler holes to eventually fill in, like photos from the 1st 2 episodes and the trailer for the 1st episode, but this 1 teaser is a good start.


                • I loved your reaction to the TV Guide spoiler, Maria. Your joy is my joy. As a Hetty fan you have been short changed in recent seasons. It would be nice to see her where she belongs, in charge, and in the office. I think we’re grown up enough to know we shouldn’t take things at face value, but the signs are good.


                  • Thanks! I do love getting excited at teasers when I’ve been so info deprived, also still have to try to remember that we’ve got a ways to go till October 10, and we know next to nothing about the 1st 3 or 4 episodes, which means the door is wide open to any unexpected surprise.


    • Just got my TV Guide. It is a small article, gives a little preview of what is to come. I cannot attach pics here, otherwise I would screen shoot it for you to read. Scott Gemmill is giving a preview of what is to come. Sadly though, it is as predicted. They’re sticking with the secret mission storyline from season 12. The article says she will try to solve it on her own but it goes south and sucks in the whole team. No originality, SMH. But yes, you will get your Hetty back!! I just hope I will get Densi back too!


  25. Sorry I am a little late to the party with regards to Maria’s question about the Kessler storyline!

    Frank is definitely “slumping”, Robbie, chuckle! (I’m actually thinking of binging The Shield per your recommendation if I can find the time!). The Kessler episode was the lowest watched episode, they lost 1.5 million viewers. Personally, I think it would have been better had they allowed Deeks to go with Kensi, but even then it was still meh.

    I do agree, btw, that Better Angels was one of the better ones, in fact, it was a really stand-out episode for me. Excellent casting with the actor who played the part of David and DR was at her best.

    It is very true that if you want to start a story arc like the Kessler one, you need to build it up. The Foyet storyline in Criminal Minds for example was played out over two entire seasons. Kessler is a heavy duty arc, not something to be blurred out in the armory while Kensi is packing her bag.

    I had never heard of Kessler (and if I am wrong, please correct me). Then all of a sudden, he is a decade-long Kensi stalker who now lives in her head? Who apparently never had the resources to contact her during all those years but does have the pull to get a presidential pardon? Uhm……no….?

    Also, Callen stated that Kessler was the case that put Kensi on Hetty’s radar; however, Kensi was with NCIS before Hetty came along so that was an odd comment for me. Then again, so was the “we survived a global pandemic” remark. What global pandemic? Not a single person socially distanced or wore a mask throughout the entire season, and in interviews before season 12 started everybody stated the pandemic was deliberately kept out of the show.

    I can actually think of an excellent way to play the Kessler story line out. And TPTB will have to address it at this point because they decided to make this into a huge upset in Kensi’s mind-set and life and then left it completely open; there is no way around it now. My version would be a two-hour series finale, ending with Deeks and Kensi leaving NCIS-LA to start a family. Much as I ADORE them, their [love] storyline was destroyed with season 12.

    As far as Callen; he was always dull and boring to me, sorry to all the Callen fans. He was completely out-acted by the phenomenal Daniel J. Travanti who played his father brilliantly. Sam was never that interesting to me either. And abandoning his young daughter and teenage son after their mother’s brutal death did not score him any points. Both his and Sam’s stories have played out IMO.

    Where can any of these characters go anymore? Another explosion at the Venice Beach board-walk? Another deactivating of a Russian bomb with one second left to go? There are so so many stories to be told (Law & Order SVU in season 22 is still going strong), but yet they chose to remain with Russia and drag out the same old plots. To me it feels like nobody is interested anymore. At least, that is what season 12 seemed like to me. Storylines, writing, casting, it was not……all there. The actors seemed to just act out their scenes, and to me the dedication to their characters’ depth was hugely lacking.

    Insider info; as of yet, none of the OG actors have shown any interest in a season 14, which is usually an open clause in their contracts. I’m not saying this could not change, just saying, as of now.

    I really wish they would stop with the BTS (or any on-screen-time for that matter, haha!) of Rountree and Fatima and give us back our favorite characters. It is clear where they are headed with this tactic, but it is not working. Some people like them and some people say they are getting used to them, but they are very few, and they are still the most disliked newbies on any series, It blows my mind their contracts were renewed. This is LA! There are actors on every street corner, lol!

    After reading the article in TV Guide (they dedicated a full two-page article to NCIS-Hawaii, btw, which I will definitely not watch) about Hetty’s return and which storyline they are going with, it seems indeed to be very predictable without any character building or backstory explanations. They are going with the same old “it’s better if don’t tell you where I was”, then her disappearing to solve it on her own, which ultimately – and I quote – : ‘sucks in the whole team’. .I am happy for the Hetty fans out there, but it won’t do anything to improve the disaster that was season 12.

    Kilbride was hired as a series regular, which makes me wonder why. Hetty is back (whom he out-ranks) and there are no two heads of OSP needed. Scott Gemmill said that Hetty and Kilbride will be butting heads. Again, why? With Hetty back, why is he there? Unless they plan to have Hetty on and off again with mysterious disappearances, it really makes no sense otherwise. And though I loved Kilbride in the beginning, the cranky old man routine (and often crude disrespect) started to get on my nerves.

    Meanwhile, OPS seems to stay empty, as no new hires have been announced or seen, which leads to a question I have often posed and will repeat: Nell and Eric did this job full-time for 12 years, to have a field agent run up and down every now and again has zero credibility. If it is possible to run OPS that way, then what have Nell and Eric been doing for the past 12 years? Play on-line solitaire?

    So yes, sadly, I think it will be very predictable (with a lot of faft-forwarding), as it seems nobody has the energy for any significant or new plot twists. And I am still wondering what in the world season 12 was…chuckle!


    • Kessler had never been mentioned prior to Season 12. That whole arc appeared out of thin air. And honestly, if they wanted an example of how to handle arcs Hawaii Five-0 specialized in multi-season arcs (McGarrett’s mother is a prominent example, along with many others). NCIS NO had them as well, but not to the same extent. Five-0 was practically a collection of 2-3 major arcs interspersed with cases from time to time. The Shield, of course, is one big arc (but that’s easy to do when you know roughly how long the series will last…it’s harder when you don’t, which in some ways makes Five-0 quite impressive).

      As I’ve said before, and I think you have as well, M, I think they’re trying to recreate the Granger-Hetty dynamic with Kilbride. I think it will fail, if for no other reason than they don’t have the time to create the history between the two characters that Granger and Hetty had. I think one of the “old guys” from Hetty’s Vietnam days would have been a better choice (because at least then there would have been history to draw on that would be familiar to regular viewers…and at least one of them wasn’t afraid to put Sam in his place), but no one asked me.

      Frank Military is oddly slumping, and I don’t know why. Shawn Ryan was the show runner and sometime writer for The Shield (and later The Unit and now SWAT), and he always seems to manage to maintain direction of a show even when he’s not actively writing for it. For whatever reason Frank seems to have lost his focus (I always thought he had the firmest grasp on Deeks, and maybe they directed him to other plot lines that don’t interest him as much). If they brought him in to write for Sam, they don’t seem to be letting him do it (and I know he should be able to write like that considering he did episodes for The Unit) or there’s something else getting in the way. Better Angles was very good because it had a tight focus (though I agree it would have been stronger had they let Deeks take a hand) and played to solid dialog, which is one of Frank’s strengths in my view. He’s also very good with emotional episodes, and has been since his Miami Vice days.

      I also won’t be watching NCIS HI. It strikes me as a quick replacement for Hawaii Five-0, and that’s not a show that can be easily replaced. It was uneven at times, but it had a style and dynamic all its own along with a rock-solid team dynamic that never varied even when they had major casting changes.


    • Raising the Dead aired after Cash Flow, in the 10 pm slot. That’s why the ratings dropped.

      If Caleb and Medalion want to post BTS pics and videos, they will. It’s their right.

      Still not looking forward to KIlbride being Hetty’s partner. Though, I am looking forward to Hetty putting him in his place when he steps out of line because Sassy Hetty put downs haven’t been around lately!

      I think it’s already been explained or established that Hetty was at NCIS before the show started, mainly because from the 1st episode, it looked a bit obvious that the team already knew her. (Callen definitely knew her). (Also, Replacing Macy with Hetty was seriously one of the best decisions this show did.)

      NCIS is still going strong into it’s 19th Season. So, maybe Season 13 will be a surprise in episode quality, I’m always opened to being surprised, no matter how cynical I may get before an episode. (Imposter Syndrome surprised me by being a good team centric episode!)

      I don’t really pay attention to ‘Insider Info’, mostly because most of it is tabloid junk.


      • Not really, if anything, Cash Flow was meant as a lead in for Raising the Dead. If you’re already watching, you keep watching, or you DVR.

        Not talking about Caleb and Medallion, but about the NCIS social media platforms.

        Hetty can’t put Kilbride in his place because he outranks her big time. If anything, he can send her on her merry way.

        And inside info being tabloid junk? Uh….no. Both my employers know Shane and are good friends with JPK.


        • Granger outranked Hetty, yet they always sparred. This is hardly any different, if at all.


          • True, but Granger shined at letting Hetty be Hetty. Kilbride won’t.


            • Don’t think it really matters. Because if the show lets him fire Hetty, then there will be major outrage, not just from fans, but from the team. The team sees Hetty as their true leader, and if KIlbride messes with that, then they’ll object. (Callen will certainly object!).

              Ranking has never really mattered with this show. Because if it did, then the team would see Kilbride as their true boss instead of Hetty, and that would be troublesome. It might bug some, but this show has worked quite well over the years by ignoring some rules or stats and seeing certain people for who they really are, either as leader or a problem.


              • Callen will object, Sam will object because Callen objected, and Kensi will object because the two Alphas objected. Would Deeks? That one’s much harder to answer.

                I know you have your take on the team, Maria. At one point in the series I agree, yes, Deeks would have objected with the rest. But I’m not so sure now. Not after Afghanistan, not after Mexico, and not after the whole mole saga. Even though Callen and Sam haven’t really advanced as characters, Deeks (mainly because of ECO and a few inspired episodes he was given) has. And Hetty has certainly slid back from what she was in the first few seasons. That cannot be objectively denied. Too many gaps and omissions have taken place, and it’s just not possible to hit the reset button. Not at this stage of the game.

                I’m hoping they can salvage something and give the series the sendoff it has earned. Something like Hetty returning to her form before about season five. Kensi and Deeks actually having grownup discussions and Kensi giving Deeks the respect he has both earned and deserves. Callen growing up and moving past his compulsive angst. And Sam actually being a father to his kids. I know when Hawaii Five-0 was ending they allowed for plenty of space to close out the characters. I think at this point that’s about all NCIS LA can do. Rountree and Fatima are not going to save the show. They’re stick-figure characters with no real depth or chemistry.


                • Hetty has always been the same mysterious woman throughout the whole show. Nothing really changed after Season 5. She’s always had her secrets, she’s always had her methods of getting things done, nothing’s really different. The only thing that’s different is the lazy way the writers have handled her during Linda’s recovery periods! Other then that, Hetty is still the same. (At least her happiness came back this Season after being very mysteriously depressed throughout Season 11, because that was depressing, and we never did find out why.)

                  Do I think Deeks would agree with everyone else in such a scenario? Yes, I do. After all, Hetty DID give him his badge! In a big way, he owes her.

                  What I mainly what Callen to do is decide whether or not to marry his girlfriend! What I want is for Densi is to not be so eye rolling at times with the baby angst, I don’t really know what I want out of Sam, but I think it’d be to try not to be annoying at times.


                • Also, back in Season 9, back when the agents went to save Hetty, Deeks went right with them. No questions asked. That’s enough for me on the ‘loyalty’ front.


              • Naw, the team went an entire season without Hetty and with Kilbride. They had no problem adjusting. The only one complaining was Nell. Other than that, everybody did their jobs and lived their lives. I can’t remember any time at any point where anybody said “boy, we really really need Hetty for this one, can’t do this without her”.

                And Deeks owes Hetty absolutely nothing. If anything, it is the other way around. All the times he risked his life for the team and her, no questions asked, and then to put him through the horrible humiliation that was FLETC only to get an Investigator badge? With her self proclaimed connections and power, she could have just gone to SecNav and given him his NCISLA Special Agent badge. With all the liberties they take in this show (there is no Russian consulate in LA!), that never came to mind?

                The whole team owes Deeks at this point, not the other way around.


  26. Team appreciation comment:

    Hetty, a tiny yet fierce woman, formed this dream team of agents and trained them to fight the worst crimes throughout the world. That, is incredible in so many ways! She taught them loyalty, she comes to their aid whenever they need it (Season 6 with her old foe, Season 8 with the mole, Season 10 with Mexico and the wedding), and they repay her by coming to her aid whenever she needs it.(End of Season 2, beginning of Season 3, Season 5’s Fallout, Season 6, and so on!)

    They all may have their secrets, which I respect. because secret keeping is a sad evil of their line of work, but they trust each other, and that goes a long way.

    They may have their difficulties, but through the worst, they stick together and brave the storm and live to fight another day, that’s incredible.

    They’re a found family, through and through.


  27. Lovely comment, Maria, I love the idea of “Team Appreciation Comments”, but I think herein lies the danger of ‘fan fiction’. Sometimes, people build up their favorite characters to the point the lines between their fiction and the actual show blur.

    Hetty is a tiny yet fierce woman, for sure, but she never formed nor trained this “dream team”. Kensi, Sam and Callen where already on the team before Hetty took over. She was handed a fully trained NCIS Special Agent with superb sniper skills in Kensi, a fully trained NCIS Special Agent with spy and uncover training in Callen, and a fully trained NCIS Special Agent who was a Navy Seal in Sam. The only person she brought in was Deeks and he never received special training; he just did what he had to do, that’s how good he is.

    It was not until years later that, for inexplicable reasons, the writers decided to give Callen the back story of Hetty “saving him” from foster care with very little and vague details as to the how and why. What she did with him afterwards is questionable, seeing as how he turned out; going rogue when it concerns his loved ones but dismissing others, arrogant and condescending, looking down his nose at Deeks, and not being able to form any relationship or get a decent place to live as a grown man well into his 30s.

    IMO, Hetty’s secret keeping has done more harm than good and put the team in life-threatening danger more than anything, starting off with Afghanistan. And from what Scott Gemill stated, this will continue in season 13.

    Through the worst, they also did not stick together. Deeks stood up to Mosely, as he should, and not a single person supported him. Deeks was fired and not a single person supported him. Sam and Callen are more than willing to go rogue when it comes to their loved ones, but leave Kensi to fend for herself (Kessler) when she really her husband. Over the years, Hetty clearly witnessed how the rest of the team treated Deeks, but did nothing to stop or change it. Not the definition of “a family through and through”.

    Robbie is correct, it cannot be denied. It was right there for everybody to see.

    This is not Linda Hunt’s fault, she just had to deal with the material she was given.

    I am hoping for the same things as you, Robbie, but I have my doubts. They have already announced they are going to continue the arc that Hetty (at her age!!) was in the middle of an active war zone during season 12 and will try to solve it on her own while sucking in the whole team. How is that any different from what we have always seen over the years?

    Of course, Callen will object, followed by Kensi and……with the baby plans on hold… will Deeks if only to protect the love of his life. It will be a repetition of what we have always seen.

    Love your description of Rountree and Fatima, ROFL! Stick figures with no chemistry or depth, OMG, so true! No way they can save the show, they can’t even save a single scene, haha!

    They might try to re-create the dynamic between Hetty and Granger, but Kilbride is such an entirely different character that Granger, and there is zero time to build that relationship up. And TBH, I am not really sure what Granger actually did…..he was in and out of scenes, he let Hetty do whatever she wanted, but what did he actually do…..why was he there?

    Callen and Sam definitely have not advanced or grown, Kensi did at one point, but majorly regressed in season 12 with her treatment of Deeks and Deeks willingness to roll over and just take it, which did not show much growth of his character either.

    The last episode of season 12 was written and shot as a series finale because the renewal notice had not come through yet. I hope that, if they start out with that mind-set again for season 13, they will do a better job of at least at least some of the characters to grown as people for the finale. But I have my doubts…….


    • We both have our own views. We see things established on the show, and we come up with our own additions, mostly because fans like me like to view this team as a family. And in turn, comes our fun theories, headcanons and fanfics.

      You can go on and on about what has happened on the show and what is seen all you want, but I also like to look at what possibly happens off screen when the hour ends, because that is where some things lie at.

      Why Hetty chose these people to be part of her team, we’ll probably never know. But she chose them for a good reason. How she raised Callen, no idea there. But I think he turned out the way he did on his own because of the whole ‘not knowing his real family’ thing.

      I like to view this team as a dysfunctional found family, and come up with my own fun stuff. Do I see what goes on in the episodes? Yes. But I also like to think of what happens in between them and after, and read fun theories or headcanons on Tumblr from other fans. This is how fun a fandom can be.


      • True, but what is seen onscreen is what is truly happening. What happens after the hour ends is….well…..nothing, except where people make things up that don’t exist (Hetty, again, never put this team together nor chose it. She was assigned to and given this team).

        That being said, I’m happy that fandom and fanfiction make you happy and you should without a doubt do what makes you happy. It’s all we have to hang on to these days, after all, lol! And you should always be a cheerleader for the characters you love, in your case Hetty and in my case Densi.

        Onward we go…..


        • Very much this. As I’ve said before, I view fan fiction as a convenient writing exercise. Nothing more. In my discussions about this show, as well as others, I try as much as possible to ground things on what we see on the screen. The only things we can absolutely say about a show are what we’re shown in that venue (and in some cases it’s possible to speak to intent if draft scripts are available). Everything else is opinion and speculation (which is fine, but it should never be confused with canon). What can be valid, and interesting, is comparing shows. How did one show handle a situation compared to what NCIS LA did, for example. Or how the team dynamic feels (in my opinion it has changed much for the worse since the death of Miguel), especially when compared to other shows with the same sort of framework.

          Pretty much all of my Miami Vice fiction is filling in holes left by the show itself, as well as a series of novels set after the show concluded to bring some closure to the characters as well as notable enemies we saw on screen but never fully resolved. But when it comes to filling in holes, I stick as much as possible to what’s shown as on-screen canon. That’s how you ground this stuff in the common reality established by the show (and it also makes for fantastic plotting exercises). But when I discuss the show my fiction doesn’t enter into it.


        • I am a Densi fan from the first time I started watching NCIS , from them getting used to each other, the looks, the banter, and their thing. Took along time then the wedding. Loved it all. Then they seemed to lose that passion ‘ it’s a love story’. Want to see happiness for kensi and deeks. Callen and Sam are lone wolfs that fight for themselves. , don’t care about anyone else. .. so tired of Russia and Anna and Joelle. They have both proven that they lie about everything. I really don’t like roundtree or Fatima, I have tried. Nothing .. and you are right the only one Hetty brought in was deeks. The rest were already in special projects. Love hearing everyone opinions ., and this is mine


          • IKR! What happened to those great “you’re smile is so perfect” moments? I miss those. The passion has gone……


  28. Here’s why I think Hetty was actually the one who chose the team: Season 2’s Christmas episode, the scene where all the agents are talking about getting their presents regifted from Hetty. That scene proved that they knew her even before the show started! If they knew her even before the show started, then is it possible that Hetty was actually their boss even before the show started in some way? I mean, back door pilot there was Macy, then when the show started, Hetty was there, and the team seemed to know her in some way.

    Let’s look at the show’s whole 12 year episode canon for a bit. Has it changed considerably enough to have it look like Hetty was with NCIS before 2009 and that she actually hand picked the team herself instead of her being in charge being a case of ‘Macy left and Hetty was just assigned to the team’? I think so.

    My mind isn’t blurred by fanfics. I know what this show’s canon is, I just have a different view of some things, and sometimes, when I’m thinking of an episode long enough, I start thinking of possible scenarios that take place either before or after the episode, and I sometimes write them. (I’ve written a lot of post Season 9’s Goodbye Vietnam fics. I also wrote 2 whole 20 chapter fics about what Hetty was probably doing in Seasons 10, 11 and 12! Because if the show isn’t going to answer those questions, then I feel like I should, in my own way.)

    And sometimes, when some things don’t really make sense, a good fic can sometimes help it make sense in a way.

    I choose to look at this show through a few lenses, not just through the episode canon, but also through possible scenes that might have happened off screen (like in Season 12’s Imposter Syndrome when Callen handed Nell that bottle of gin. How did he get it? That scene proved that he and Hetty were definitely communicating off screen! Unless that bottle just magically showed up at his doorstep with a note that said ‘Please give this to Miss Jones’, which I doubt it did.)

    Thinking of possible answers to this show’s various questions can be kind of fun if you’ve got an active mind.


    • But you just made my point: “….when some things don’t really make sense, a good fic can sometimes help it make sense in a way….”.

      When things do not make sense, it’s because the writers bungled it or because that is just the way it is. Fanfic won’t change the show’s canon, storyline, or reality. It’s great you write chapters of what could possibly be, but the truth is that it just isn’t…….it’s fan-fic, not the reality of the characters or any storyline.

      I can write an entire novel about Deeks’ and Kensi’s backstories. It won’t change a single thing of how they are portraited on the show, it will not explain what could have been or what could be going on off screen, it will not create a new reality, it will not paint them through rose-colored glasses. It’ll be just a made up story by me. Because there is nothing going on off screen. It if was, it would come up at some point on screen. And it hasn’t.

      It is a lot of fun to look at a variety of possible answers, I do it all the time. But the truth is, those are just my day-dreams of what could have been, not of what actually is.


  29. Moving on to a different topic…
    Season 3 is (IMO) the supreme Season of this show. It did everything right, from an intense premiere, to 1 of the best finales, there’s so much that Season 3 did right.
    Here’s my episode rankings:

    #1, Greed (Trying to get 2 grown men to waltz as partners, LOL!!)

    #2, Blye, K (both parts)

    #3, Lang, H (Season premiere)

    #4, Sacrifice

    #5, Deadline (Hetty’s past with Callen’s mom revealed)

    #6, Sans Voir (Season finale, both parts)

    #7, Neighborhood watch (Iconic Densi episode)

    #8, The Debt

    #9, Touch of Death (Crossover with H50)

    #10, Lone Wolf (great Hetty centric episode!)

    #11, Partners

    #12, Honor

    #13, Vengeance

    #14, Higher Power

    #15, Patriot acts


    • I’ll give it a go, most episodes have kind of merged, perhaps I should watch them all again.
      Here goes:

      #1, Neighbourhood Watch…..Densi

      #2, The Debt……………………..Deeks, perhaps I should have made it #1

      #3/4, Blye K 1+2…………………..Kensi, not sure

      #5/6, Sans Voir 1+2……………..They blew up the warehouse! Janvier/Siderov arc ticking over

      #7, The Watcher………………..Didn’t we meet Granger?

      Season 3 was definitely a good one, but not one I’ve regularly re-watched. I’d forgotten there was a ‘Lange H’ episode as well as the two ‘Blye K’ episodes. Talking about ‘Deeks M’, no not really, just thinking about the episodes I listed for Season 2. I think that handful of episodes told us more about Deeks than we learnt in the following decade. Certainly the season that completely drew me in and made me 100% a Deeks fan. I do agree in Season 3 they didn’t get anything wrong, not my favourite but a good one.


  30. Filming update:
    According to Caleb’s Instagram, Episodes 3 and 4 could be a 2 parter. As for what it could be about, well. Last week, that Russian lady (name starts with a Z) from The Bear, Russia times 3, and 1 other episode from last Season will be in either Episode 3 or 4 (or both).

    That’s all I got for now.


    • Another update: Dani posted a new video today of most of the agents in a big wide open place. (Chris, LL, Eric and Caleb are in the video.)


      • Don’t you love to see our guys in tactical gear? You don’t suppose Chris was directing, do you? That would mean Deeks has to take his kit off. I can only remember Chris directing ‘Wanted’ and ‘An Unlocked Mind’ there were others.

        So, Maria, what would you give to see clips of Linda Hunt and Gerald McRaney messing about BTS? Or even being sensible BTS?


        • Yeah, it’s nice seeing them in their gear. As for if Chris is directing Episode 4, I honestly don’t know. That’d be nice, though, I imagine we would’ve heard something by now on that front, because in the past when 1 of the cast members was going to be involved BTS, we heard about it well in advance to the episode being filmed! Like when Eric wrote Mother (heard about that 1 or 2 months before it was filmed) and when Dani directed Russia times 3 (heard about that a month before it was filmed). We’ll see.

          And your bottom question, I, honestly have no idea. That’d be really cute in a way.


          • I just wondered why it was Chris asking Dani if she was okay to ‘do the driveaway’. I also noticed he didn’t ask Eric if he was okay as a passenger if Dani did the driveaway, lol.


  31. Here’s a different kind of discussion post:
    What’s your favorite Hetty quotes? With me, it’s, a lot!! 😉 Here’s some of them:

    ‘I can’t leave you damn kids alone for 1 minute?! (Till Death do us Part)
    ‘What do you mean by shorty?’ (Paper Soldiers)
    ‘Of all the mornings that I forgot to stretch’ (The 3rd Choir)
    ‘I’m the backup’ (Fallout)
    ‘Hetty’s always nice’ (Paper Soldiers)
    ‘You know I don’t kiss and tell’
    ‘You can’t escape politics, you either play or get played’ (Dead Body Politic)
    ‘You and I need to have a little chat’ (Tale of 2 Igors)
    ‘Never let age stand in your way’ (If the Fates Allow)
    ‘It’s about bloody time!’ (Goodbye Vietnam)
    ‘You owe me your life, and I always collect on my debts’ (Three Hearts)
    ‘Trust your Instincts, they’ve gotten you this far’
    ‘Agent Callen is the closest to a son that I’ve ever had’ (Season 9 finale)
    ‘Get the hell off my yacht’ (Endgame)
    ‘Get in the damn cage, Carl’ (Under Siege)
    ‘I’m sorry. I must have nodded off’ (The Queen’s Gambit)
    ‘Keep your wits sharp, your heart open, and your gun loaded’ (Boarderline)
    ‘Tell Congressman Thomas I think he’s an ass’ (The 3rd Choir)
    ‘No, but lead lined boxers shorts will be issued’ (Core Values)
    ‘George Hamilton once told me what men really love is a woman who plays hard to get, or was it Sinatra?’ (Predator)
    ‘I didn’t choose this life Owen, it chose me’ (Collateral)

    There’s a lot more, but I’ll be here all night if I tried to list them all. 😉
    Got any favorites of your own that you can remember?


  32. In case anyone forgot, The Season 12 DVD is officially out now.
    If anyone knows what the deleted scenes are, feel free to say so.


    • A friend is working on getting the special features uploaded to Tumblr, but i did see a screenshot of the special features on Twitter:
      There’s 2 featurettes, 1 on the Season, the other on Russia x3 (Dani’s episode), also, Dani did an audio commentary. And then there’s the deleted scenes. (to which episodes, I have no idea as of yet.)


  33. Nutterbutter // August 24, 2021 at 8:15 PM //

    I’m sorry I know it’s been a while since my last comment, but life happens but I needed a place to vent my anger and taking out my rage after watching the features on DVD for S12, and I couldn’t find a better place other than Wikideeks (hope this site stays forever.).

    Spoiler Alert ahead: Sorry But I can’t grasp the idea till now after hearing FM saying that the only reason he invented Kessler was to stop the pregnancy plot WHAT! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !! WHY???? With all due respect to FM who is one of the best writers on the show and great director and honestly an outstanding actor (his performance as Kessler was really good) but I for one and it’s only MHO and can you feel free to disagree with me, I HATED this storyline and hope it ends ASAP.

    We never asked for the Baby story to be rushed, all we wanted was to see was an evolving relationship between these two in a mature way and mature discussion about their life outside work and what they are going to do with their life without the fieldwork.and also it’s only my opinion but I think the financial problems & leaving LABD would be sufficient for Densi to stop the baby train. They ended S11 and started S12 without any mention of their persistent in having a baby, so For me, all these storylines were only for the sack of the Drama and that was confirmed by both RSG & FM that they were not intended to make them have a baby in the first place now I’m livid.

    And to make it worse they all agree on the way Deeks’s Storyline has been handled (REALLY) Sorry with all due respect to RSG he wanted to show Deeks struggling because of his age and all the insecurities that it was okay to a point but then it put in question his competence. It really bothered me and made him like he was unqualified and unfit for this job despite he has years working with LAPD& NCIS. So if he was that bad how come the team leaves him to be Kensi’s partner all these years and be part of the team till now.

    I’m really disappointed guys. I thought I’d find an answer that will satisfy my curiosity and give me peace of mind but I guess not now. Sorry for any Typo or if I offended anyone please accept my apology in advance.

    Jessie, K


    • I have to agree with you Nutterbutter , I was hoping Kessler would fade out after season 12. , all I wanted for kensi and deeks in season 13 is to find that happiness, see them at their new house, not sure what happened to bar, just the banter and fun that we saw from season 2 till the wedding. They show a little here and there since the wedding , not much. It’s been misery and sadness for awhile. I know people want a densi baby , but I don’t. It hard enough seeing them in scenes together, if she got pregnant where would she be opts. 🤨I would like them to go back to basics, fighting crime in Los Angeles, with their regular partners. Forget Russia with Anna and Joelle, so over it. Heaven only knows who will be in opts. Thanks for listening


      • Nutterbutter // August 24, 2021 at 11:48 PM //

        Thanks, Kathy sorry if I sounded aggressive up there.
        What bothers me is that all they have been through was for nothing. The fertility treatment, the invective Deeks had to Indore was for nothing. Don’t get me wrong I am the last person who wants them to have a baby unless it’s the final season of the show. All I’m saying is why they bothered in the first place.
        Like you, I want the banter, the joking, making fun of each other but not in a condescending way, the sentimental and emotional moments they share, the caring and worrying for each other.

        But to create this character out of thin air and forced into the story just to stop something you don’t have the intention to go with it that for me means they don’t care anymore about the contents of the show.

        And as I said before they already had enough on their plates to hold on to their plans for the future or having a baby.

        I don’t know if it’s because of COVID, or the state of the world, but this season was so dark for my taste and saddening. There were fewer banters and most of it was at Deeks expense or out of place, the team was scattered around, even the storylines were also heavy depressing.

        I hope they end the Kessler and the Russians stories this season and enough with Callen’s background and hurting Kensi and putting Sam’s family in danger and making fun of Deeks.


        • I wish I could say something to make you feel better Jessie, but I can’t. I have to agree with you. I could carry on all day and not put it any better than you. I agree with Kathy too. Why do TPTB find it so difficult to treat Deeks with the respect he deserves? No doubt I will feel the same as you when I get the Season 12 DVD. We will just have to hope for the best with Season 13.


    • Hi Jessie, sorry I’m a little confused. Had you not seen season 12 before? Did you only just watch it……? Because all these comments and conversations we have been having all this time, and the letter WikiDeeks put together to end “Incompetent Deeks”, were a result of season 12……

      I know there are people on here who have been commenting without having seen all seasons yet, so that’s why I was wondering, that’s all.

      (You didn’t offend me, no worries, lol!)


      • I think Jessie’s issue is with Frank Military’s comments on the DVD.


      • Yeah, Patricia is right, I’m talking about the FM & RSG commentary on the DVD.
        I know my comment could offend someone but that was not my intention, but I’m calmer now and in my happy place (LOL) so I hope my next post will be lighter and clear than the above.


  34. This is what happens when you check wikiDeeks before you look at other things. It’s a good idea to check things out before you comment. That said, I still agree with Jessie.

    I do now understand what TPTB were trying to do, and up to a point agree with them too. I think it was time for Deeks to move on, although I don’t think they tried too hard to get any mileage out of his police career. Plenty of stories to be told. Making Deeks struggle at FLETC, okay with that. Not okay with making him look weak, but we’ve been here before. To my mind it would have been better to see him struggle with things we know he is not so good at, like defusing bombs and tech stuff. I understand giving Deeks angst and troubles to deal with, they like to do that. They didn’t think of giving him any reward. He was told to go celebrate, later when Callen was available. I would like to see a scene at the party where Sam shakes his hand and welcomes him to NCIS. Did the rest of the team have to pick their badges out of a drawer? Didn’t they have somebody shake their hand and tell them ‘well done’? Perhaps that’s not how NCIS works.

    Creating Kessler as a creepy character, to become a story arc. I could go with that. I understand they wanted to have Kensi and Deeks have adult conversations about their futures, had to be a good thing. So why did they have to have them at work? Why bring in Kessler to scupper baby plans that were already on the rocks?

    I think I can see what they were trying to do and they do have to try new things, just don’t think they quite got it right. If they want to try something new, they could always try giving Deeks a decent storyline. They could really think outside the box and make Deeks happy.

    Just sayin’. Nothing new.


    • Oh, thanks, Patricia for your kind words I really appreciate your empathy and you always find the right thing to say to left my spirit up.

      First, just to clarify, I’ve already watched it but like Patricia said my turmoil is from the FM & RSG commentary on the DVD.

      Second, also to clarify I’m not a writer; hell I’m not even sure I can finish my comments without struggling to find the right word to describe what I’m thinking.

      With that being said, I thought that if you are a writer or storyteller took the time to build and form an idea so you get to the main theme not to scratch that and start all over again. (PLZ feel free to correct me if I’m wrong as I said NOT a writer)

      I’m talking about a show that took 6 years to make Densi happen, then 10 years for the wedding, so I expected that becoming parents will also take some time to develop the plot. But what gets me why to create something and make some fans (not me) root for it, only to create another worse story to stop it.

      They could use the financial problems as a reason to stop pursuing the treatment, or Deeks being sent to FLETC so he is not around, or even they didn’t even decide what and when they are going to leave their job to start a family, any one of the above, could be used as a reason to postpone the baby story.

      No offends but some fans reached the point to justify the horrible way Kensi treated Deeks due to hormones and the shots. Now you’re saying (sorry, scratch that, that was wrong, let us start over) so they confirmed what we’ve all been discussing here that the Densi baby is not gonna work for a police show unless it’s the finale season or god forbidden if ECO or/and DR are leaving.

      As for Deeks story sorry, I’m also confused here, he could join the NCIS years ago after he felt it was home (the debt) or after the IA and Whiting holding his confession over his head or after Mosley fired him or even after Rogers asked him why is he still in both (S10), so pick your poison and anyone of them would be satisfied and would save him the humiliation he endured during the FLETC.

      So how this was the right time? And what is the difference between the silver badges and the gold ones? What about the IA investigation was it stopped? What about he was so loyal to the LAPD that he didn’t want to sign the papers but they find it easy to let him go after being with them for god knows how long (I remember Bates admiring him and he said is still one of them and wants him to come back I think in S03 & S09)

      I know I’m rambling and I swear I was not intended to write all of this, but the commentary really pissed me off as I was looking for some satisfactory expansion about the purpose of these stories, and don’t let me start about Callen’s story or it will take another hour to get out all my feelings.

      I thought maybe they would say that they created the Kessler plot to build the back story of Kensi and to get to know her past, or what they did with Deeks was only to convince people to pursue their dreams whatever their age or condition, or dragons & unicorns are real (LOL) even I would be satisfied if they said that was only because of COVID and ECO’ prenatal leave.

      I definitely don’t know what the future holds for the show, but I really hope they could rectify the mistakes and gaps they had done for the last 2-3 seasons and give us something satisfying for all the fans.

      To end on a positive note I am looking forward to season 13 and I’m happy my favorite show is back and I will continue to watch until the end or more accurate (as long as Deeks & ECO still in), hoping we can see more core team scenes, some romantic Densi scenes, and competent Deeks scenes and we get better storylines


      • I like your comments Jessie, I am also confused about the silver(investigator) and gold (agent). Hetty had tried to get him to be an agent for years and being with them 10 years, doing everything the agents did. Truly don’t understand that one. Listening to Dani and Eric talk they are fine with everything that’s been happening. I don’t agree with a lot of things , but can’t do much other than look forward to season 13. I will say it again tired of Russia and Anna And Joelle. Can’t they find someone normal for him. I also would have liked to see them celebrate deeks NCIS investigator badge. But nothing. I was hoping Kessler was off the table , but guess not. 🤨 I want kensi and deeks to find some happiness and show it. I really am hoping they don’t have kensi or deeks injured anymore. ( especially if Kessler is involved) and Sam and Callen better step up to the plate and support kensi and deeks for once. I have nothing to say about roundtree and Fatima. Sorry


        • Oh, Thank you so much, Kathy, for taking the time to read my comments.
          I totally agree with you about everything you’ve said especially about the part ECO & DR are okay with it.
          I think our hopes for next season are almost the same except I don’t mind seeing Deeks being hurt or in danger situation just to see some care and worry from the team, and Kensi could appreciate him more and could give him a clear answer about their life after NCIS.
          But they need really to stop hurt Kensi & Callen they are like every couple of episodes getting injured or find themselves in a dangerous situation or in a fight scene.

          AS for Roundtree and Fatima like you, there is nothing to say or do to change the TPTB’s decision about them so they could enjoy the ride, but don’t wait for me to jump in, I’m also sorry


  35. I’ll admit, I kind of feel bad for the Densi fans that wanted that baby to happen.

    But in all honesty, the odds were always going to be against them in some way. As M has explained several times on this thread, what good was really going to come out of them having a baby? If either of Deeks and Kensi leave the show, a lot of fans will leave with them. And given that this show has really been suffering for the past 3 years (bad writing, mostly to do with having to cover for Linda while she recovered from that accident), this show needs all the fans it can keep if it wants to keep going past Season 13, (or at least keep them somewhat happy enough to have them keep tuning in or recording the episodes!)

    It might be fun to dream about them raising a baby in fics, but on the show, I think it’s time to accept that it won’t happen until maybe the very final episode. Or maybe they’ll adopt, anything can happen at this point.


  36. Still singing to the choir, but I don’t think it does any harm to keep saying these things. You never know TPTB might take notice, pigs might fly.

    Jessie, your comments never offend me. It’s scary how often you say what I’m thinking. You might not be a writer but you certainly understand what writing is all about. When the writers get it right it’s great, but when they don’t, well it winds us up. The whole FLETC issue is classic. I understand making Deeks join NCIS was always their intention. I would rather he stayed a cop. It was a big deal. I understand that they would make it difficult for Deeks. The other times Deeks was ‘fired’ he was sent back to LAPD, but this time the problem was LAPD. TPTB effectively forced Deeks into applying to FLETC because his situation with LAPD was uncertain. It just seems they got fed up with the storyline and left us hanging. Did he really pass or did Hetty pull more strings? Why Investigator not Agent? A hug from Kensi and the promise of a party might have been enough for Deeks, but not enough for me. It was a big deal and a big let down. I understand they might want to keep us guessing, but we have to guess about an awful lot.

    The baby issue I think everybody saw it coming. After the ‘Mexico’ argument it was always going to be a problem. I think Deeks was resigned to not having children, and I think they should have left it there. It wouldn’t have been fair to Deeks, but not much is. Certainly a baby would kill the show but I’m not sure they needed Kessler to put a stop to it. If Kensi was in her twenties postponing a baby would be fine, but the chances of conceiving don’t improve with age. Now I’m rambling, other options are available.

    I didn’t see much of Kensi snapping at Deeks, but it does sound realistic. Can’t justify it but people often lash out at their nearest and dearest when they’re in pain or under stress. Has to be said Deeks doesn’t.

    I’m on the same page as Jessie and Kathy with Season 13. When I wrote about making Deeks happy, I didn’t mean leaping about clicking his heels. He is a cheerful soul most of the time, but it would be nice to see somebody show some appreciation, a gesture of kindness. There is so much to explore with Deeks, an intriguing character, but they never do. They could give him a storyline were he can strut his stuff and show the team his skills, but for some reason I don’t think they want to. Can only hope.


    • Oh, Patricia believe me I feel the same. Sometimes I find that I don’t need to comment on the subject, as you’ve got covered and spoke my mind.
      I think we have done with the guessing game for god’s sake it’s been 12 years now we should’ve something concrete especially with Deeks the TPTB only gave us a whiff of Deeks background or something about his personality without addressing it appropriately and leave us to guess the rest of it. I think he has a lot of plot holes in his story and contradictions more than any other character in the show that needs to be filled and they left us as fans to fill the blanks. And every one of us is trying to interpret his actions or these gaps on his own without a solid answer from the TPTB.

      Even when all the fanfiction writers try to fill these gaps (Which by the way big thanks to wikideeks authors & writers for the amazing Deek, M series, I enjoyed so much) they’ll never get what the TPTB are planning to do with the story or the character that only leave us with speculations unless we see it on the show, and create more debate issues among the fans.

      Don’t sell yourself short in this department, even if you haven’t seen the new season doesn’t mean that you’re not adequated to express & voice your opinion about what is wrong or what’s right for the characters even if you only watched the sneak peek or even the Densi moments only (which by the way they are what it matters) most of us and I’m one for sure who speed the episode to these moments. I really hope you can watch it soon & I’m eager to know your thoughts after watching them. Oh, and the snapping is real and very existent you’ll see.


      • It is good to take other people’s opinions on board and I’m sure if we tried hard enough we could find something to disagree about, lol. It’s just reassuring, and nice, to have somebody who thinks along the same lines.

        I think the fact that wikiDeeks exists tells us something. I am very grateful that it does, thank you to all involved. People like Marty Deeks. Well, maybe not everybody, there’s no accounting for taste. By and large we are all rooting for him. He must be one of the most under utilised characters in TV history. I was going to say wasted but I don’t think that would translate. They’ve given us enough to get us interested and left us hanging. I don’t need to know his entire life history but it wouldn’t hurt to tell us some more. It makes for great discussions but we really need the facts.

        I do feel a bit churlish complaining about things. I think we got some awesome, emotional scenes from Eric and Dani, we always do. Their performances are always second to none. I understand why they would want to make Deeks suffer. Nobody does angst better than Eric. The guy lost his career, his bar, what little self esteem he had and his wife was in danger. I just think it would have been more powerful, and rewarding if we had seen the team reach out to support Deeks. Apart from early Season 8, it never happens. Same with the ‘snapping’. I do believe you. It happens, I’ve been snapped at and I’ve snapped. If it continues, the supporter needs support. Did anybody talk to Deeks? While Deeks was in the depths of despair, Kensi was having a singalong with Sabatino. When Kensi was struggling, Deeks was right there with her. Okay he wasn’t having the hormones, but it was his struggle too. Did I see Kensi having a talk with Nell?
        Bit of a ramble there, sorry.

        I don’t mind being corrected when I get facts wrong, you can’t argue with facts. I’m not sure when Season 12 will be available here, soon I think. I’ve just finished Season 9 in my re-watch. Not sure whether I should finish Season 11 before I watch Season 12, or just go for it. Then I will know what I’m talking about. Maybe.


        • I’ve to agree with you on this one again, looks like it’ll be a habit (LOL).

          Clearly, I’ve nothing else to add, all I’m gonna say is you don’t need to watch S11 only the episodes that matters and show how the snapping has evolved & who suggested the adoption idea in the first place, also how Kensi dealt and still dealing with the whole pregnancy like a mission she needs to accomplish, and she is treating that like it’s something that only matters and concern her only but not her life partner who wants to be a father since they created his character in the show and how he’s his own demons that play tricks on his head whether questioning his ability to be a father and doubting himself or his insecurities that comes from fear of losing her whether because of the danger of their job or that she could walk away from him if he kept pushing that matter. “Yellow Fever” “Mother” “Answers” other fun or more Densi recommendations will be “Hail Mary’ “High Society” “Fortune Favors the Brave” “Concours D’Elegance”


          • I’m looking forward to watching ‘To Live and Die in Mexico’ again next week. I have watched Seasons 10+11 but only once and it’s all a bit vague. As am I. It will be good to be reminded how the baby business evolved. I only remember Kensi decided she wanted a baby with Deeks in ‘Mother’, when she thought Deeks was going to die. When Kensi wants something she expects it right away. Yet was it ‘Yellow Jack’ Kensi thought she might be pregnant and was less than thrilled?


  37. Elaine Conway // August 26, 2021 at 4:05 AM //

    I thought it was clear that Deeks had passed FLETC but Hetty wanted to be the one to give him his badge so she pulled strings to have them send him home and make him think he washed out so she could do that. When he talked to Kensi on the phone he said that he was in line to get his badge and couldn’t understand why he was being sent home. It might have been nice if Hetty had let him get his badge with his class with Kensi watching on but the writers couldn’t let that happen. And then of course there was the badge making Deeks the only investigator in the NCIS universe. They like to keep him down. They don’t realize how boring that has gotten.


    • Sorry, I’ll ‘fess up here. I didn’t see the episode, just watched so many clips it felt like I had. I suppose that’s why I shouldn’t comment on Season 12. I did try to stop but…. Still, it seems a mean trick. I agree keeping Deeks down has become tedious.
      Thank you for putting me right.


  38. This is more of a response to Jessie than an actual comment but knowing myself comments will seep in anyway, lol.

    I don’t buy the DVD’s. Everything is available to rewatch everywhere. The commentary does not interest me that much (for any show actually), tbh, mostly because it is promotional BS. The commentary Jessie is referring to is readily availably on several IG accounts, which I watched so I would be able to comment after actually seeing it. Some people comment on here about seasons they haven’t even seen yet.

    The thing to understand is that ECO and DR are under contract and have zero choice in airing any grievances they have about the show or their characters. Actors who have done so in the past (in other shows) have been punished by being killed off, being written out in another way or simply getting less and less screen time. Whether they agree with a storyline or arc, it does not matter, they have no other choice than to speak in favor of it. Same goes for adding the newbies. I remember LL Cool JJ’s response about their addition. He was so very clearly reading from a tele-prompter. He was not happy. But he had no choice in the matter.

    The top person in charge is the showrunner. He/she outranks everybody with the one exception being the network itself and from what I have seen over the past few seasons, the network has cared little. My guess is the call to add the newbies did come from the network in a ‘diversity’ move that sadly back-fired, not only because of their choice of actors but of the way they are forced upon the general fanbase. Shane Brennan has not been involved in the show in years.

    A great example is the recent social media interaction. What have fans been begging for? Deeks and Kensi, and Hetty. If anything, BTS Deeks and Kensi, and Hetty. What do we get? A Q and A with Rountree and Fatima. SMDH.

    I saw a Deeks and Kensi BTS in a car (where COD snapped at Kensi about taking her mask off….uhm….he is her co-worker, not her boss) but no BTS with Hetty? There are still-photographers on set. Linda Hunt has no input in what CBS decides to put out there. If she is in the first 3 episodes (which have been shot by now), there are BTS pics and vids available for them to put out whether she wants to or not. Same with Deeks and DR. But, again, what do we get? Rountree and Fatima.

    About the FM and RSG commentary: This is my take: I think they are trying to salvage the train wreck that was season 12. FM stated that they ‘invented’ Kessler to kind of get the pregnancy out of the way, however, Kessler entered in season 3 when the pregnancy storyline had barely started. Therefor, inventing Kessler in the 3rd episode made no sense. You’d be doing that in, for example, the 12th episode, once you really got to see how bad it was going, not by the 3rd when it had barely started. Also, Deeks was indeed away for FLETC, so how much did they really have to try and get pregnant by then anyway?

    I am convinced Deeks 100% still really wants to leave their jobs, find a safe place to live and work, and start a family. That does not just “go away”. He is only there because of Kensi. When the announcement came he made it into FLETC, his face fell. Who’d want that anyway, in your forties after doing what you have been doing for 12 years, overseas in warzones and all?

    As I still see people on FaceBook and IG begging for a Densi baby, which boggles my mind, I will repeat what I have said so so many times: It is an impossibility in their current jobs and it will be the end of Densi in the field, which will be the end of the show because there is nobody who can carry this show on their own. There is a huge difference between people in law enforcement [starting a family] and what they portray on the show. There are bombs going off in every episode and they had to purchase a house under an assumed name. The only way for a Densi baby is the series finale episode.

    Thus, I think, the commentary was simply re-done and edited in after as some sort of damage control which I do not think anybody with a logical mind can possible buy into.
    Same goes for RSG. He gave an interview after the season finale, stating why they put a pin in the pregnancy storyline but his commentary on the DVD’s says somewhat different.

    So if even the writers and showrunners can’t keep their stories straight, what are we, the viewers, left with? Fan fiction perhaps, but I stay away from that because it creates a false narrative and builds up stories about characters in ways that does not exists, which ends up in a huge disappointment because it never matches up with what is portrayed in the actual episodes.

    There have been so many comments about how Deeks was portrayed and treated in season 12 that even WikiDeeks started a letter/petition to get to RSG, and I started a conversation about how the way Kensi treated Deeks would never ever be acceptable if the roles were reversed. People would scream abuse from the roof tops.

    I do not think it is going to change much. Perhaps they will reign Kensi in some, but I doubt we will see any romance or intimacy. This, btw, has nothing to do with Covid. Every other show has intimate scenes with zero problems. From what I could see from the BTS vids, Deeks’ hair is out of control again (please please somebody comb it!) and he is goofing around. Now, I know those are BTS, but he never got any respect in 12 years, I don’t think they will turn the tables now. Thankfully, I saw DR’s hair is out of her face again! I don’t know why she was in a car with COD stunt double since people have been begging for Densi back in the field.

    We can all hope for a competent and respected Deeks, but in order to do that he also has to stop goofing off and act the part; he is a 43-year-old career NCIS employee, he is not a 25-year-old newbie anymore. If you want to be taken seriously, you need to start acting the part and demand respect. But, of course, ECO can only do so much with the material he will be given.

    Personally, I thought FM did a terrible job in portraying Kessler. He just was not imposing enough. The bare chest didn’t help and neither did the dialogue. “I want to have sex with you”. Seriously?? Compare that scene with the scene from The Silence of the Lambs when Clarice met Hannibal in his cell for the first time (which is clearly what they were going for and hugely missed).

    Kessler is not going away. They started this and now have to end it. It’ll be predictable. Hetty’s return is predictable. It was already stated she will come back and stick with her ‘secret war zone’ mission from season 12, the guest stars for the first episodes are Russians so guess where that is going….?

    And yes, the snapping is definitely real. For those who comment but have not actually watched season 12, you are in for a rude awakening. Deeks was so clearly struggling but despite all the so-called IVF hormones, Kensi could not find a kind word or gesture for him, which she was more than happy to do for Sabatino and everybody else (and btw, what is Sabatino now? He was a Russian who became CIA and was clearly the enemy at one point….how did he end up working with the team….?). Deeks has been there for Kensi every single time for during everything she went through, but not much can be said vice versa. She is lucky his love for her is that strong.

    I am remembered of an episode which starred Lance Hamilton; at the end of this episode Fatima and Kensi arere in the boatshed at which time Lance came back with Sushi from an expensive restaurant. Kensi stated that Deeks would have loved this to which Lance replied: “I would never spend this much money on Deeks”, to which Kensi replied “Actually, he’ll never know the difference”. It is bad enough to do this in front of him but behind his back is another step over the line. Remarks like that irk me to no end (and that is an understatement to curtail the language). I know for a fact Deeks would never in the world disrespect Kensi by speaking about her (or to her or in front of her) that way.

    The way Deeks was treated at FLETC, well, it kind of has been hashed to death by now, but the way it ended was quite horrible as well. To make him think he failed and let him sit on a plane (with Kensi’s knowledge!) by himself and walk into a dark and completely empty mess, I have no words. After all he has done for his team members and they families and their loved ones.
    There were so many different ways this could have gone (and Investigator, no way! Special Agent for sure!). I remember when Rountree showed Sam and Callen his NCIS badge, there were huge and congrats all around. Nobody could do that for Deeks? Instead, the airtime goes to a scene of Fatima whining about her failed acting career? Please, somebody kill those two off already or send them to Alaska.

    I agree with Jessie as well, as I have pointed out before, the opportunities for Deeks to have left the LAPD and become a NCIS Special Agent have been endless over the years. Hetty gave him the paper work early on, we were never given any answer or explanation as to why he never signed them. His loyalty to the LAPD has always been an utter mystery to me. They treated him horribly when he was there as well as after he left with the relentless Whiting story (which was also completely lacking credibility, there was no way she could have harassed him this long, let alone blackmail him into helping her, which Deeks, with a law degree, should have known).

    As far as the Deeks, M. episode, there is not enough time to cover what has been left unsaid, unanswered and unexplained. I think it will do more harm than good at this point. It does make me wonder though why ECO as an actor never got one while the others (even Anna Kolchek!) did.

    Same goes for Kensi. I would still like an explanation how it was even possible for the daughter of a Marine to spend a year on the streets. Her mother never reported her missing and out of all of her father’s staunch and loyal squad members, not a single person was able to find her? She was 15, a minor. She had not choice in staying on the streets or not.

    Well, sigh, that was it for now. Everybody have a great weekend!


    • Your reply is quite impressive M. I agree with a lot of your points of view. I have to say I blame most on the writers. They gave up. So sad., I think Covid doesn’t have much to do with Eric and Dani, they still banter at times but I guess they decided no more kissing , hugging what newlyweds usually do. I don’t like Fatima ( always crying about something) and roundtree , heaven know what he does. I am not trying to be cruel , I think they dropped them in the mix with no plan.. I know Russia and Kessler involved this season but so , so over it. If they want NCIS La to end that bad, give people want they want this season. RESPECT for Deeks and a happy life with kensi. I like Hetty and kinda of looking forward to her and Kilbride getting into , but nobody can replace granger. I think Callen and Sam heads got to big for the series. Lone wolfs all the way. Deeks deserved to be a NCIS La AGENT.. thanks for listening


    • I actually own the first 4 Seasons on DVD. (beats always recording the reruns). I’d buy the next 4 on DVD if I had money to blow, and I don’t have much at this time. Maybe at Christmas.

      I’ve only heard of what I’ve heard from the S12 DVD extras, I’ve heard of some of the deleted scenes thanks to @erichristianolsenfans on Instagram, but they’re from episodes I don’t care about that much. (I don’t suppose there was a deleted scene of that Hetty/Kilbride ‘chat’ from the finale?).

      No offense, but your complaining about Fatima and Roundtree is getting a little tiresome. These are 2 good actors who are trying to promote this show in 2 cute ways. (haven’t read the Q and A on CBS’s Twitter yet, but I bet it’s cute.). For all we know, Dani and Eric don’t want to do much promoting right now, I don’t know. But I’ll take whatever promotion I can get right now.

      I agree with Kathy, there’s no one who can replace Granger. There’s practically only 1 reason I’m even remotely interested in Hetty/Kilbride, is well, Sassy Hetty. Other then that, I still see this as a poor attempt to copy something that I feel can’t be copied.

      FYI, my fanfics about the last 2 Seasons? They’re way better then every bad episode from the last 3 years combined! Yeah, I’m well aware that 99% of my speculation/ideas never get used in the episodes, never hurts to write them down in fanfic style though. I actually have fun writing some of them.

      I have zero idea why Deeks waited so long to quit LAPD, but hey, he has his badge now, that’s what matters now. (IMO).

      Not sure what Episode 5 could be about just yet. (only seen a filming location pic and a pic of Caleb looking all fancy fancy.), maybe more info this week.

      I still don’t know what the first 4 episodes will really be about yet (BTS pics only tell a tiny fraction, the spoilers the network puts out tells more), and I doubt I will for at least another week or so. (this week, I’m sort of expecting CBS to release the Season premiere press releases and promos for the first 2 NCIS’s, crossing fingers!), but I’m keeping an open mind for unexpected stuff out there.


      • Marie, everyone has there own opinions on different actors and actresses. Just like I can’t watch some of episodes with Mosley ( great actress I am sure ) but couldn’t stand how she treated everyone especially deeks. My favorites will always be kensi and deeks and I have all 12 episodes. Be there for those you enjoy watching and I will too. Doesn’t have to be the same. I love NCIS la and will watch season 13 with the same excitement as the other seasons. I am allowed to wish for certain things , a happier kensi and deeks and they give him his due. Be proud of him.


        • I know I know. And I respect everyone’s opinion, just gets a little wearisome hearing the same complaint about the same person over and over again sometimes.
          I’m also feeling optimistic about Season 13. I’m also proud of Deeks. And Hetty will always be my favorite. 😉


          • And I never belittle you about Hetty, Hetty, Hetty. Totally uncalled for.


            • I know, and I’m sorry you feel offended. I’m just glad there are actors on set promoting the show, even if it’s 2 people you don’t care about. Lot better then nothing at all.


              • Well, no worries, lol. Not offended. It was disrespectful. A lot of people talk about the same characters and plots and stories and things all the time and I know it becomes repetitive, but in all fairness, you do the same with Hetty and I never disrespect you by calling it ‘tiresome’ or whichever term. And in all fairness again; call out everybody, not just me.

                But no worries, I will probably do it again, chuckle, just skip it if it’s tiresome. You know what they say: If you have nothing nice to say…….We vent our frustrations about the show and characters, but that does not mean we have to disrespect each other on this platform. Have a good one!


        • Thank you Kathy. It’s not like Maria is not endlessly moaning about Hetty. I’d never resort to belittling. That remark was uncalled for.


  39. I’ve been thinking about what might have one wrong on Hetty’s mission in Season 12, and I have 3 guesses:

    1, Killed the wrong person
    2, Suspect got away
    3, Someone died under her watch

    If I were a betting person, I’d say numbers 1 or 2 sound more likely. (though, I’ve been wrong before with these kind of ‘theories that sound really likely, but never happen’)


    • See what I mean? Hetty, Hetty, Hetty……..but I would not be disrespectful and call you tiresome.

      As far as Hetty’s mission, I could have sworn you were the one who always says she does not like to speculate…..hmmm….anyway, we don’t even know what her mission was or what her capacity was in that mission, so little point in going there.


      • Regarding Hetty and the mystery “mission:” it will be whatever half-baked answer they come up with…one that will likely change two or three episodes down the line.

        Your long post, M, is pretty much what we’ve both been saying for some time. I don’t totally agree with you about fan fiction, but I also don’t read much of it in all honesty. Most of what I write is for a show that’s been off the air for over two decades, so I can fill in gaps or extend story lines without it being contradicted by something that pops up on the air. The community I write in also seems to appreciate someone bringing the show back to life, as it were.

        Otherwise, yeah. The Hetty train for me left the station a few years ago and just hasn’t come back. A part of me really thinks they should have ended it this year…done some kind of nice wrap-up with Eric and Nell leaving and just let it go. I’ve been watching Chicago Fire, and the character development on NCIS LA is so paltry by comparison it’s almost embarrassing.

        Maybe this should be the last season, and they should dedicate themselves to doing it right. Close off the empty plot lines. Have characters other than Deeks confront their own failings and omissions. You know…serious drama stuff. I’m sure enough explosions could be wedged in here and there to keep that side of things alive, but I think they owe it to the fans to at least bring closure to the main characters once and for all. And M, you must hate Alaska if you’d wish Fatima and Roundtree on them. Better yet…pack them off to Hawaii. I hear there’s some openings there…


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